Doctors trying to gag their patients

[Fashion Lad!]

You are SOOOO lucky. You're Lucky McLucky from the planet Luck. You rub unicorn horns and find four-leaf clovers and you know which rainbow has the pot of gold.

I don't think I've had any doctor (excluding specialists) who hasn't failed me in one way or another since I became an adult. And I'm not talking about 'okay, that test proved it isn't thing X, so let's look for Y..' sorts of failures.

I'm talking disregarding symptoms, flatly telling me I'm imagining things, not asking obvious diagnostic questions (from someone who claims to specialise in the field!), refusing to prescribe medications the specialist *HE* sent me to recommends...

Maybe you are imagining things? I don't know.

My girlfriend practically has to beg me to go to the doctor. When I'm sick, I avoid it. When I'm injured I avoid it. If I can't treat it at home or it's just not getting better, then I go in. Usually I get from the doc "you should've come in sooner."

I go to the Mayo Clinic, they have some of the best doctors. Maybe that's also it. I've asked both my parents if they've had a bad experience with a doctor. My dad said no. My mom said when she was in the Air Force she had a bad sinus infection and the doctor went to put pressure on her sinuses and she slapped his hand out of the way. He was an officer and said that he could court martial (or whatever) for striking an officer. Other than that, she has not had a bad experience.

Of course, I'm only 24 years old. Maybe I just haven't seen enough doctors. But, sarcasm about the fact that I haven't had a bad experience... wow.

[Pedersen]

How about my experience with doctors? Will another anecdotal data point help you at all?

I spent about 5 years of my life dealing with severe recurring ear infections. Hell, as a 7 year old, I knew I needed tubes put in my ears. But (for reasons I do not know) we couldn't get the doctors to agree to it for 5 years. Let me clarify for you:

Severe means excruciating pain, of the sort that I've only experienced rarely since then, and that level of pain requires me to have a migraine.

Recurring means at least once a month (more often was common).

Finally, I got the tubes put in. However, when they were removed, the guy who removed them did such a bad job of it that I have scar tissue on my right ear drum, resulting in a permanent 20% hearing loss.

The big bonus, though, is that the ear aches went away. After that, I don't remember having one for about 20 years. Which comes around to the other end of the spectrum: The specialist I saw after that ear ache found a very severe condition. And by very severe, I mean of the "This could kill you, and it would be an extraordinarily nasty death, too." He performed the surgery to correct it. He did what he could, but there is now even more damage in that ear.

That second doctor, though, I'd give first rate reviews to. He managed to preserve things so that it might even be possible for me to go scuba diving someday (I've just never bothered to get cleared for it since then).

The ones from when I was a kid? Most of them I'd gives solid thumbs down to. They allowed a chronic problem to continue unchecked, treating with medication after medication. Today, I can't really take amoxicillin due to that. That's what they gave me. And they gave it so often that my body can make no use of it anymore.

The only one I'd give a thumbs up to would be the one who performed the actual surgery back then. He didn't save my life, but he did dramatically improve my quality of life.

The only one I know the name of, though, is the one who performed my recent surgery. Dr. Jay Murphy, who (at the time) worked out of Louisville and Boulder, CO. Fantastic doctor.

Any doctor who would be worried about the review I would write would fall into one of two categories:

1. Terrible bedside manner.
2. Terrible abilities.

And if a doctor fits one of those profiles, I don't really want to go to him/her. Why shouldn't I be able to learn this about the doctor in advance through whatever public discourse would be available?

[Seshat]

But, sarcasm about the fact that I haven't had a bad experience... wow.

It was intended as humour, not as insult. And yes, you are lucky, if you've never had a bad experience with a doctor. I just thought I'd express my envy of your luck with doctors in a funny way.

Maybe you are imagining things? I don't know.

... this, however. I can't figure out a way to take this as anything other than you thinking my experiences may be invalid.

* In seven years of seeing a doctor, who knew I wasn't getting fully healthy, who could see how I walked, who could see the pain in my movements and expressions, who did test after test after test, and who was supposed to be a specialist in the systemic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome and fibromyalgia; she never once tested me for fibromyalgia.
Which it turns out I have, and have had for many years. Including then.

* My best friend (okay, not me, but this is a recent incident) has a problem with chronic, constant nausea. Last week she went to the doctor who organised for her to be tested for IBS (which she has), and told him that the treatment is improving problems with the lower end of the digestive system, but she still has the nausea.
"What nausea?"
"The nausea that was the initial complaint."
"You never told me about that."
"It's written on the patient chart."
"Oh. Well, you have to be imagining it. I'm not going to do any tests about that."

* The doctor who sent me to the specialist for the fibromyalgia diagnosis doesn't want to prescribe me maintenance meds that the specialist recommended. They're in the GP's pharmaceutical schedule, and don't require any authorisation other than a GP - they're not in the 'specialist only' list or anything like that. But he's 'not comfortable prescribing those'.


I have other examples, these are just ones that stick in my mind, or are recent.

[AFPheonix]

There will be patients that will write bad reviews based on legal crap they just flat out don't understand, or because they can't comprehend why Dr. Smith didn't write a prescription for Lil' Jimmy for antibiotics when he clearly had a viral infection.
But, a lot of that can be prevented with decent bedside manner and explanation.

However, you should be able to get the dirt on a doctor by researching them with the medical board. Sometimes customer sites can be pretty overdramatic, as I'm sure we all know.

[Slytovhand]

I tend towards the freedom of speech line. What next, not being allowed to talk about a doctor to your friends. (sure, I'm sure defamation laws are there for a reason). In a way, I'm surprised the whole idea of such a website for reviewing doctors didn't happen years ago. But to deny someone health care because they're scared of what might be said about them?? That's just ridiculous... after all, isn't that what they're paying insurance against? Defamation??

As for the 'they rely on their reputation'?? Since when? When you're sick, you go see your local GP. It's not like you've got a stack of choices in the matter... it's not so specialised that you can have an option to drive a lot further (for most people). And if it is that specialised, it's not going to make a lot of difference anyway (unless it's travelling 1000 miles one way versus the other way).

And lastly, not that I've seen House, but a bad bedside doctor manner just might be the absolute best person you need to see! One who doesn't care about your ego, but knows everything there is to know about your meat-sack. (not saying there is a 1 to 1 connection there )

[MadMike]

Still, I don't like the idea that they're going to violate someone's Constitutional rights. Freedom of speech, anyone? Last time I checked, we still had that it this country. Also, I don't see how this is different than any of the other "consumer" boards around the net. You don't see mechanics, retail employees, or other people wanting a gag order because someone chose to criticize them. Instead, I see it as a few doctors who are upset that someone dared to criticize them. If that's the case, they need to grow up a little and deal.

Agreed, and this is coming from someone who has several family members in the medical profession. My mom and stepdad were a doctor and a nurse up until they retired a couple years ago, and my brother is a pharmacist. I didn't always get along with my stepdad when I was growing up (some of that was him, and some of it was me being a stubborn teenager), but I always thought he was a damn good doctor.

However, there are also some doctors out there who shouldn't even be trusted to treat a mosquito. I'm sure my stepdad would agree with that, as he's had to testify against another doctor in a malpractice suit at least once. One of my closest friends almost got killed by a doctor just over a year ago. She was pregnant and when she went into labor, they chose to do a C-section, and one of the doctors had a staph infection. She ended up getting gangrene inside her body and almost died. Thankfully, both she and the baby are fine today, but it was scary for awhile, especially having to return to the hospital several times. Last time she had to go back was last June, so I'm hoping nothing else goes wrong. After what happened, I get worried sick about her if she gets so much as a sniffle.

Overall, I have a great deal of respect for doctors. They have to spend years in medical school, and have to make damn sure they don't make any mistakes. If I make a mistake in my job, the worst that happens is a file gets lost, and as long as the company has good backups, chances are it will be recoverable. But if a doctor makes a mistake, someone could die.

[protege]

My mother's been a nurse for the past 30 or more years. Some of the things she's seen...really shouldn't have happened. Incompetence is a bit more widespread than we'd like to think. Hell, I nearly suffered from someone's fuck-up...

Back in 1994, I had hernia surgery. It was relatively minor, but whoever gave me the "happy juice" nearly killed me. How? Well, the bitch (and I'm being nice here) took my weight...and then disregarded it. She gave me a bit too much. Meaning, that I nearly didn't wake up after the operation

Also, I hope nobody thinks that I don't have respect for doctors. Yes, I do. The good ones, who are out there saving lives, have my respect. I should mention that one of my uncles is a doctor...and a damn good one.

[Seshat]

I have a cousin who is a psychiatrist, and if he applies the traits he has in the rest of his life to his work, he's a damn fine one.

The specialist who is treating me is a damn fine doctor, and the psychiatrist who treats my best friend is great. The cardiologist who specialises in my husband's rare heart condition was a great guy too.

Good doctors exist. But so do incompetents and bad doctors, and maybe I've had more than my fair share. But I have encountered plenty of the latter, and too few of the former.

[Boozy]

Good doctors exist. But so do incompetents and bad doctors, and maybe I've had more than my fair share. But I have encountered plenty of the latter, and too few of the former.

Sometimes I think people expect too much of doctors. The human body is not like a computer. It's a million times more complex, and no two are made the same.

Doctors are human. Most of them do their best. I've had a few with terrible bedside manner, but they were good doctors. I don't expect much empathic ability in an individual left-brained enough to graduate from med school.

[AdminAssistant]

I have mixed feelings on this. As a TA and (hopefully) future professor, I actively hate sites like pickaprof and rateyourprofessor. Because today's students get so PISSED if you don't bow down and give them everything they want. Of course, they also get to do official evaluations which have some impact on whether or not I can keep my contract, which quite frankly scares the hell out of me.

BUT, I see the other side as well. It's a Constitutional/Free Speech issue, people have the right to complain. But I do understand the doctor's frustration.

[tropicsgoddess]

You may have your trolls and all, but I like the fact that there are sites to rate your doctor. I was chatting on IM with my baby sis and she doesn't really trust the doctors by her school, so when she gets home she'll see a doctor. I see doctor rating sites as a good tool to finding the right doctor for you and if the doctor doesn't like it, maybe he/she needs to step up and treat their patients better.

[katie kaboom]

I see doctor rating sites as a good tool to finding the right doctor for you and if the doctor doesn't like it, maybe he/she needs to step up and treat their patients better.

Amen! That's all i've been trying to say.

[Evandril]

Doctors are going to have one big problem with review sites though...People are FAR more likely to make the effort to post something when something didn't go perfectly, than they would be if they'd had a decent visit. If you visit the doctor, he does a good job looking you over, and there's nothing wrong, how likely are you to go to the effort of finding a review site and posting that?

That being said, if a doctor gave me something like that to sign, I'd have a lawyer draft up something stating that if the care I recieved was not perfect, I could refuse payment without complaint. Even then, I'd be leery of seeing that doctor.

[Fashion Lad!]

I'm not going to argue about freedom of speech. That's one of those things that cannot be underminded.

Yes, there will be incompetant doctors. What if a doctor gets a good review because the patient asked for a drug and the doctor wrote the prescription because they asked for it, not because they needed?

It's our right to talk about them and get a new doctor if need be. It's their right to request that we don't talk about them or rate them.

[tabbyblack13]

There is the whole freedom of speech that I believe in but a person should really think about what they say. You are responsible for what you say. If a doctor that I have never been treated by gave me one of those I would leave right away. If was treated fairly and asked to sign one of the gag orders I would start to wonder what is going on here. If you get bad treatment you should be able to tell people about it. I would go right to the insurance company or the state heath board if I had a problem. A lawyer would be second.