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  • People who don't pick up on hints

    I tell all new friends that I do not date. I am not sexually active, I am not looking for any sort of partner, I don't appreciate people setting me up for dates, and all that other jazz that follows along. I am one of those 'single and loving it' sort of girls.

    Now, I have a close group of friends who have been going through drama recently (cheating, depression, apartment and job searching, etc). I have known for quite some time that one of them, I'll call him "Joe," has had a crush on me. He is easily infatuated with women, no matter their looks or personality--he's not exactly a master of the dating scene, if you know what I mean--so I took little notice of it. I am quite awkward with relationship conversations and try to be as blunt as possible with my opening statement (as mentioned in the opening paragraph) and then never mention it again.

    ...I may need to underline 'quite awkward' though. Joe finally told me that he liked me, a moment I had been dreading since the first crude sex joke he had made concerning the 'size of his socks.' I kind of stood there awkwardly, mumbled out a thanks and turned and walked away. A bit rude, but we have been well aquainted for a year and he really ought to know that I don't take suprising situations like that very well.

    A month, maybe a bit longer, and the subject has yet to be brought up again. Except now there's company. Another close friend, "Mark," seems to be hinting that Joe likes me and that we would make a nice couple. Now, don't get me wrong, Joe's a nice guy, but he is on the opposite end of the spectrum when it comes to 'my type.' When Mark and I are later alone, I do make sure to tell him that I am not interested in Joe, end of story, no more pushing.

    And then suddenly Joe starts acting a bit curt, a mutual female friend talks to him and finds out he's upset that I have yet to give him a decision, a 'yes' or a 'no' on his offer of a relationship. Wait, so he was only being friendly bcause he wanted to get into my pants? Did he not read any signals whatsoever? Signals being quite obvious, mind you, which weren't strong enough to show as I have a flirtatious attitude (as I was later told, which makes no sense as I controlled my actions whenever I was around him to discourage the crush). I stopped hugging him, I only hung out in groups and not one-on-one, I completely ignored every crude joke, I mentioned my relationship-abstinence a couple of times to be on the safe side. Nope, he picked up on none of those hints over all this time. Now, I know it was up to me to tell him flat out that I wasn't interested, but I am not the kind of person who is comfortable with intimate discussions whatsoever and I completely dread even the thought of them.

    To ease the difficult situation for myself, I told the girl I was not interested and to tell him for me, and she (a master at being honest without being rude) relayed the message.

    It took nearly a year for him to tell me he liked me. A year (I figured out the crush thing near the beginning) of me hinting that I did not feel the same. A year of apparent false frindship, as his attitude would suggest. I feel like a freakin' genius compared to how well he was able to comprehend everything going on.

    I absolutely hate when people don't pick up on the obvious disinterest and see things where nothing is--a relationship, for example, or a 'friend' that you can't get rid of (without needing to hide the body later).

  • #2
    I used to think that the best way to reject a man's advances was to strongly hint that I was not interested. But all it does is allows them to keep a small sliver of hope. Rejection I've learned is best done quickly, cleanly, and directly. As women, we need to know that saying "No, I'm not interested" is suffiicient.

    Refusing a request for a relationship is not impolite. Sending requests for a relationship via a third party is impolite, but I forgive that transgression easily, since so many good and kind people are painfully shy.

    The real villain in the story here is Mark. Putting aside my distaste for intermediaries in situations like this, Mark had clearly agreed to speak to you on behalf of Joe. But apparently he was only willing to give Joe positive feedback. When you told him that you were flat-out not interested, he had a responsibility to relay that to Joe. Except he misplaced his testicles and gave Joe a wishy-washy answer, allowing him to continue carrying the torch. Mark's inability to put aside his own discomfort and tell his friend the truth made it seem to Joe that you were stringing him along. That is fair to neither you nor Joe.

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    • #3
      Giving a guy POV, I'll echo Boozy. Don't "hint." Don't think you're being obvious. If you knew the guy was awkward, why did you ever think he'd pick up on any kind of hint? Guys have an amazing capacity for self-delusion when it comes to girls they have crushes on. They always think they'll be the exception to the "doesn't date" or "not my type" lines. Telling a guy flat out "I have no interest in dating you" is both easiest and kindest to everyone involved.

      I'll echo Boozy a little in agreeing Mark was in the wrong for not passing on your full sentiments, but you are absolutely as much to blame for not telling Joe yourself in plain language.
      Any comment I make should not be taken as an absolute, unless I say it should be. Even this one.

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      • #4
        (Damn... trying to come up with some sort of opening line... like "I know Boozy really feels something, she just needs to find the strength to say something"... )

        But anyway...

        My absolute best skill or talent in this life is to completely mis-read a sign. I'm absolutely amazing at it!! I mean, I look back through my life and I see (quite obviously) the opportunities I've missed - and how that would have changed my life (been married... and divorced ). And, of course, the ones I'm interested in who wouldn't have a bar of me....

        There's one I had a bit of a crush on, and she pretty much destroyed that crush with "Honestly, you don't do that much for me". Ok, it works, even if it hurts.. but then, truth apparently does.

        I've been saying for years, a little pain never hurt anyone. Also, it's just an ego....


        Just remember - when talking to guys - guys like to build things.. so use bricks! Subtlety doesn't work....
        ZOE: Preacher, don't the Bible got some pretty specific things to say about killing?

        SHEPHERD BOOK: Quite specific. It is, however, Somewhat fuzzier on the subject of kneecaps.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Slytovhand View Post
          <snip>
          Just remember - when talking to guys - guys like to build things.. so use bricks! Subtlety doesn't work....
          I love that line. That's awesome.


          Yea, I've noticed that when dealing with guys, you tell them straight up in simple language. They aren't so good at the head games and hints as girls are. The good part about this is that I also know that guys don't read into things as much as girls do...so for the most part you can take what they say at face value.

          My SO despises hints and mind games. If you want something, tell him! (I tend to think he's good at picking up hints for the most part- in person he seems to read my moods pretty well). But yea. If I want a phone call, I call him or tell him to call me. If I need help with something, he won't help me unless I say, "Hey hun...help me with this" It's nice. Takes the guess work out of everything. I know that if I tell him something straight up, he'll take care of it. And if he wants something, he'll be up front, too. And I don't have to worry about if he's upset or anything, because if he is, he'll tell me!

          I dunno. In the OP it sounded like TehShush made it pretty clear that she isn't looking for someone to date, and when Joe's friends started pushing the issue, she flat out told them "not interested."

          I mean, short of taking a frying pan to the guy's head I don't see how she could be any more clear.
          "Children are our future" -LaceNeilSinger
          "And that future is fucked...with a capital F" -AmethystHunter

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          • #6
            Here's the advice I kept giving my ex-girlfriend. Guys do not understand subtle hints. We don't get obvious hints. You just have to flat out say what you mean. He says he's interested in you. Don't hint at not liking him. Just tell him "I don't like you like that."
            Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst. - Starship Troopers

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            • #7
              Originally posted by DesignFox View Post
              I mean, short of taking a frying pan to the guy's head I don't see how she could be any more clear.
              That's why I think Mark really dropped the ball here. He needed to man up and say to his friend, "Look, dude, she ain't interested. She was very clear about that." But I'd bet my last dollar he didn't say anything of the sort. He tried to let his pal down easy and white-washed it a bit. It made it harder for Joe in the long run.

              And that's one reason why I don't like intermediaries for stuff like this. I can appreciate that some people are very shy, but its so much less painful in the long run to deal with the risk of rejection (or the possibility of success!) head on.

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              • #8
                Thank you all so much for the feedback on my little problem.

                I'm working on being more upfront right now, I have a close female friend who is helping me confront awkward conversations and it seems to be helping a little bit. I just wished I had been able to tell him outright that I wasn't interested, like you all have advised me, when I first noticed his crush.

                I think most of my awkwardness did not come from the rejection itself (as I've told complete strangers that I wasn't interested, before), more along the lines of him having been considered a close friend and my not wanting to disrupt our friendship by having that sort of conversation. I think that by putting it off, I messed it up more than it would have been if I had told him early on, which I defnitely regret.

                I didn't quite think of Mark as having been in the wrong, I wasn't even paying attention to the fact that Joe wasn't backing down after I had talked to Mark. Thank you for the different perspective on that, it really opened my eyes to details like that and I can see other similar instances like it now that I think back.

                Originally posted by Slytovhand View Post
                Just remember - when talking to guys - guys like to build things.. so use bricks! Subtlety doesn't work....
                Use bricks... Shall I chuck on at his head every time he hits on me?

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                • #9
                  I still think hints are a perfectly acceptable way to communicate. I always saw it as your failure to comprehend, not my failure to communicate.

                  I pick up on other people's hints, and I'm not a wonderfully perceptive person. If people were in tune and thought about someone other than themselves just once in a while they'd pick up on it too. I.e. if I'm telling a hugely long story about my infected toe-nail and I see one of my friends sigh, roll his eyes and look away, guess what, he's bored! I'm boring him to death with my stupid ass story! So I stop talking. I change the subject. Yay! I picked up on a hint! Its not at all hard.

                  And sometimes you HAVE to drop hints. Like when this lady at work, for some unknown reason...I had to leave work early to go see my father who'd just had a heart attack. And for some reason, she told my boss that she actually saw me go to the bar and the heart attack was just a lie. So then the next day I told her about this awesome movie I saw where there was these two wal-mart employees, and one of them lied to the boss to get the other one in trouble, cuz she told the boss this guy was out drinking when he was actually at the hospital....so anyway this guy who got screwed took his revenge and burned her fucking house down. See? If I had just flat out told her "Hey, you even THINK about doing that again and I will burn your house down." I would be in jail.

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                  • #10
                    Hints are only appropriate if you don't have the balls to man up and say what you actually mean. Many, MANY people in this world are not wired to pick up on what you might deem to be obvious, and it is not their fault that they don't get it. Guess what! People don't think like you. Don't delude yourself into thinking they should get it.

                    As for your example of you threatening to burn someone's house down for lying to your boss... I don't know how you possibly consider that even remotely appropriate. I hope karma comes back to you in a big, big way.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by the_std View Post
                      Hints are only appropriate if you don't have the balls to man up and say what you actually mean.
                      *clap clap clap*

                      Seriously. Hints are passive aggressive bullshit.
                      I tend to ignore things like that on purpose.

                      Now, I'm sure there are SOME situations where hints are better than brutal truth. But I think they are rare.

                      I have a few friends who would ask to borrow money. Except they wouldn't ask. They'd hint. "Oh, man, we really don't have the money to pay for this right now."

                      Me: "Sorry to hear that." *changes subject*

                      I know that's different than what's being talked about above, but it really irks me.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by the_std View Post
                        Hints are only appropriate if you don't have the balls to man up and say what you actually mean. Many, MANY people in this world are not wired to pick up on what you might deem to be obvious, and it is not their fault that they don't get it. Guess what! People don't think like you. Don't delude yourself into thinking they should get it.

                        As for your example of you threatening to burn someone's house down for lying to your boss... I don't know how you possibly consider that even remotely appropriate. I hope karma comes back to you in a big, big way.
                        Under normal circumstances, its not appropriate. However she could have gotten me fired just so she could entertain herself with workplace drama and make herself look good to the boss. She crossed a line and as such she doesn't deserve appropriate methods any longer. But of course that's ok, because I'm always the bad guy.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DrFaroohk View Post
                          Under normal circumstances, its not appropriate. However she could have gotten me fired just so she could entertain herself with workplace drama and make herself look good to the boss. She crossed a line and as such she doesn't deserve appropriate methods any longer. But of course that's ok, because I'm always the bad guy.
                          I never said it was appropriate for her to do what she did, either. Lying to the point where someone could lose their job is always wrong. But an appropriate response might have been, "I don't appreciate you lying to the boss about me" rather than, "I'll burn your house down". Your escalation of the issue and the extremity of your response does indeed make you the bad guy.

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                          • #14
                            Ah, but who created the initial situation?

                            Look at it this way - if you go into Harlem and start yelling the N-word, you don't get to claim self-defense when you cap someone for trying to stab you.

                            Without her vicious lie, there would have been no subtle threats. Lying has consequences. Fortunately she didn't really have to face any of them.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DrFaroohk View Post
                              Ah, but who created the initial situation?

                              [/snip]

                              Without her vicious lie, there would have been no subtle threats. Lying has consequences. Fortunately she didn't really have to face any of them.
                              Except that the difference is - you have no control over what other people choose to do. She chose to lie and there was nothing you could do to stop that.

                              By choosing to react in the manner you did, threatening assault and arson, you sink to her level and become worse than she is. If you really had such a problem with her not facing consequences, you could have talked to HR about hostile work environment, about another employee trying to get you fired. Those would have been the correct things to do. But you chose to take it to a whole other level. That makes you the bad guy.

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