Schools today

[Kimmik]

I am putting this here instead of social woes because it is something that I truly despise... I mean in that red hot I want to take a baseball bat to the folks responsible until what gray matter they have oozes out.

Schools today are moronic stupid shells of education... No longer are children taught basic skills... it is all about the test scores... and making the school look good.

No longer is there a focus on the important things like reading, math, critical thinking and the like... it is all about pushing kids through and making the numbers.

When I was in high school, economics and government were mandatory. You were actually forced to do well or repeat the grade... there were classes that taught trade skills for those that were not higher education inclined. I am sorry not everyone should go to college.

There are cashiers that I work with that can not count change back... there are many that I work with that think that reading is a waste of time... that think that u, tnx, kk, y, are proper ways of spelling and that all English is American English. I helped my niece with her resume and almost died from the sheer horror of it. She actually used net speak and slang. ex: U should hire me cause Im a rlly hard worker.

People look at me weird when I tell them I plan on home schooling my daughter because I want her to have a real education. Reading, writing, math, science, art and to know more then what she needs to pass a Standardized Test. I fear for the future.

We need to remember not all people will pass and telling someone that they failed is not a bad thing... it just shows them where they need to focus. *sighs*

Is it just me or do others see the American school system as sorely needing a re-write?

[protege]

I agree with you. All too often, you get people in charge...who simply want to pass everyone. That is, they're afraid that an "F" on someone's paper, will lead to "self-esteem" issues. Sorry folks, but if you fuck up, you shouldn't be given an easy ride.

Case in point, we've been getting resumes with chat and/or "AOL-speak" on them. I don't even bother with them--that crap goes right in the trash. By displaying that sort of thing the applicant has already demonstrated that they're an idiot, but also that they don't take things seriously. No thanks--I've got plenty of other applicants to pick from

[MaggieTheCat]

A good friend of mine is a public school teacher (High school English for 30 years) and I think she would completely agree with you. Things have drastically changed, for the worse, from what I understand from her. She doesn't work in the HS anymore. She works for a local charter school, which is a different way for kids to get secondary (middle school and high school) credits to graduate. Rather than taking 45 or 90 minute periods all day every day, they do different projects and activities throughout the day. They do a lot of stuff for and with the community. If they need credits in English, they can pick a topic they're interested in and do extensive research on it and then write a paper and do a speech or presentation in front of the rest of the school about it. Depending on what topic they pick, they might also get other credits for it. For example, if they picked something that had to do with history, they could get social studies credits as well. It might take them a whole semester to do all the research as they might travel to different towns to talk to experts or people who are experienced in whatever subject they picked. Of course, there are still some subjects that are given like "regular" classes, like math. And if a student of the charter school wants to take an extra curricular course like band, they can go to the high school for the band period every day and then return to the charter school for the rest of the day.

The charter school has been open for I think 5 or 6 years now and they are doing exceptionally well. They have been able to take kids who don't fit into the cookie-cutter environment of regular school periods and turn them around, giving them useful skills and knowledge that they can apply outside of school. And actually get these kids to graduate. It's not a school for just the "dumb" kids or the kids who don't want to apply themselves. The kids in the charter school work very, very hard and the teachers push them all to their limits (in a good way.) One of the great things about it is that there are only about 100 students and I think 7 or 8 teachers. So the student to teacher ratio is great. The kids get a lot of one on one attention from the teachers and stay with the same group of teachers all year, rather than bouncing around to different teachers depending on what classes they're taking like in a HS setting.

Unfortunately, due to budget cuts and the fact that the school board and most parents of non-charter students hate the charter school, the charter school is going to be shutting down either after this year or after next year. There are actually parents of HS students who didn't want charter students who were graduating to march with the rest of the HS graduates because they believed the charter students were "inferior" and they didn't want their kids exposed to them. Makes me absolutely sick. The charter school has helped a lot of kids graduate who otherwise would have dropped out. I think the school district is making a huge mistake in shutting them down.

[Mr Slugger]

Totally agree as well. My oldest daughter is in middle school, and sometimes I attempt to talk to her about something I was taught in school by her age, and she just gets the glazed look in her eyes and says they didn't teach us about that. And it just amazes me. Plus I mean she learned to tell time on a digital clock in school. She learned to tell time on a normal clock from us. Yet they're trying to teach her trig and calculus in the 7th grade. When I was in the 7th grade I learned about the supreme court, and how the justice system worked, by having a mock trial in the classroom for a week. I think I remember more from that lesson than most of what I learned in high school from the teacher goes over, do home work, test type crap I got in high school when the mandatory testing was just about to begin. And now that's all my kid gets.

[Flyndaran]

To show how absurd anecdotes can be, I had the opposite problem.
I have a fear of large bodies of water.
To pass high school, I had to pass P.E. To pass P.E., I had to pass the swimming section. You see my dilemma? "Fortunately" my teacher was a lazy slacker that accepted a half-terrified dog paddle across the short width shallow end of the pool.

[lupo pazzesco]

At work today, I had a young boy come in, about 9 or 10, theoretically old enough to know how to add/count money, yes? He bought a bottle of soda, with tax, it came up to $1.62. He gave me $1.50 in change and looked at me expectantly, probably wondering why I wasn't giving him the carbonated goodness. I put the change on the counter, and proceeded to count aloud, pointing out that he didn't have enough to buy the soda. He said, "Ok, I'll go get more" and runs out the door. Upon returning, he has another handful of change, $1.46, and asks me if that's enough now.

In a longwinded answer, YES, the American school system desperately needs an overhaul. Between the driving forces of standardized tests = more funding and that No Child Left Behind Bullshit, kids aren't getting educated. And then they come to college, believing they're the future of our country and our world, and I have to deal with them trying to buy textbooks and their disbelief that said books are actually necessary. More, they're desperate for books that help with their English/Math homework because they were never taught proper sentence structure or the PEMDAS method of solving a complex math equation.

My brain hurts a lot sometimes after encounters like the above, and the unpleasant thoughts it evokes...

[AdminAssistant]

And then they come to college

Oh, they do, oh yes they do.

My current university has an 'open enrollment' policy. Which means that everybody that graduates high school in this state with a C average automatically gets in. And in a state where Religion is frequently taught in Science class, I can't imagine a C average is a great accomplishment. Especially in the corn and wheat-filled wasteland that lies west of Topeka. *shudder*

They come here, some full of hopes and dreams, but many with this overwhelming sense of entitlement. That they should be able to slack and sail through their classes, party for 4 years on Mommy and Daddy's dime, and then walk out with a college degree. It's infuriating. But since the state is broke (as in, "we might get our salaries furloughed this year" broke) the universities are desperate to bring in tuition money.

We've already been told that the University is cutting back/eliminating travel funds for graduate students. Which sucks, since I just got accepted to present at one of the top two national conferences for my field (if the panel I'm on gets approved). *sigh*

Sorry, didn't mean to de-rail. But yes, these kids can't write. My friends who TA Western Civ tell me that they have no concept at all about history. It's very sad...

[BroomJockey]

PEMDAS method of solving a complex math equation.

I know BEDMAS, but not PEMDAS. What's the P?

[BlaqueKatt]

Unfortunately, due to budget cuts and the fact that the school board and most parents of non-charter students hate the charter school, the charter school is going to be shutting down either after this year or after next year. There are actually parents of HS students who didn't want charter students who were graduating to march with the rest of the HS graduates because they believed the charter students were "inferior" and they didn't want their kids exposed to them.

well of course they're inferior.....at memorizing useless crap to spew back without any comprehension like a good little drone-they're actually OMG-learning and thinking.....didn't you know that's not what school is for-it's for socializing, and rote memorization....

Just like the GED or HSED is considered the "easy way out"-even though over 40% of seniors that will earn their diplomas would fail the GED/HSED exams.....

[gremcint]

I know BEDMAS, but not PEMDAS. What's the P?

I think Parenthises instead of Brackets but I don't know for sure.

[BroomJockey]

Yeah, that would make sense. We used actual brackets though, when we learned it. Didn't learn until later most people tend to parentheses for initial set-offs, and then brackets for enclosing any parenthetical statements. Took some time to flip styles.

[Greenday]

This thread makes me thank God every day that I went to a public school where I learned up to calculus, I read lots of novels, learned history from the Magna Carta all the way up to present day, knew EVERY SINGLE DAMN COUNTRY in the ENTIRE world by 7th grade, I know Spanish, I know most religions of the world, and learned some decent science. All thanks to public schooling.

Then I went to a state college, where I currently am now, and am learning chemistry from one of the best chemistry departments in the country.

So even though I didn't like most of school, it baffles me that despite my crappy schooling experience I learn A LOT more than other kids. It's hard to be to think that so many schools don't even teach a small fraction of this stuff.

[Boozy]

I have a fear of large bodies of water.
To pass high school, I had to pass P.E. To pass P.E., I had to pass the swimming section. You see my dilemma?

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

Do they refuse to give high school diplomas to disabled students in your state? "Sorry, until you get your asses out of those chairs, you ain't graduating. Now swim, bitches!"

[the_std]

When threads like this come up, I wonder if it's all just observational evidence or if there's any proof to show that schools really do suck that much more now.

I can't say anything about the American school system, but I only graduated high school three and a half years ago and I got a pretty well-rounded education. Sure, there were some shitty teachers and yeah, there were some morons in my classes, but overall people were at least moderately intelligent and the teachers were competent. We tend to notice the bad ones because they stand out so much more. I could tell you a hundred stories about the idiots in my school, but only about a dozen about the smart people. Doesn't mean I went to a dumb school, it just means I noticed them more.

[Dreamstalker]

well of course they're inferior.....at memorizing useless crap to spew back without any comprehension like a good little drone-they're actually OMG-learning and thinking.....didn't you know that's not what school is for-it's for socializing, and rote memorization....

I think the charter schools are an excellent idea. Not every kid is good at or wants to memorize pointless facts just to get a grade....or for that matter run the gauntlet that is high school cliques *shudder*

I was Waldorf-educated until third grade, and I like to say that spoiled me for public education forever. I was the kind of kid who always came up with a solution that the teacher wasn't considering...I was praised for that in middle school, but come high school I was suddenly being penalized (don't even get me started on the nightmare known as "EMP Math").

In "social studies", I was a fairly consistent C student (I don't like memorizing stuff that I know is pointless) until deciding to buckle down and study my tail off for the final. That got me an A...and an accusation of cheating by the teacher. That was overturned after a meeting with my mom, where we showed her how hard I had crammed for this.

The same thing happened in English; that was actually a pretty serious accusation (wait...my best work is suddenly plagiarism because you don't think I'm capable?). While I wasn't expelled--expelling a "special ed" student would not have looked good for the school system--my failing grade was not overturned; it got to the point where the teacher didn't even want to talk to my mom or me about it without a union lawyer.