"proud to be an American"

[draggar]

I'm not saying shut up and accept it. You ranted here about it - why not go to your senators and representatives about it?

I've only been to Salt Lake City once (from your location) so I can't comment on how homosexuals are treated there but here (south Florida) it isn't as large as a problem as you're making it seem (besides - if someone didn't want you living there based on your sexual preference - would you really want to live there anyway?). I'm sure there are issues here but my homosexual co-workers and friends decide they're better off without dealing with bigots like that.

Many companies now offer the same (or very similar) benefits (health insurance etc..) to "domestic partnerships" (mainly directed to homosexual couples living together) as they do to married couples. Even 5-10 years ago this didn't exist.

About your drunken fundamentalist - anyone could be their target. We've had abortion clinics bombed because of fundamentalists. 9/11 was executed by fundamentalists. The Klu Klux Klan was a form of fundamentalism and after they were a "security force" they turned to white (and Christian?) supremacy.

Don't think you're the only one being persecuted. One of the reasons my wife can't get a job is because she's not a minority so they consider her over-qualafied (is that double edged prejudice?). I was refused TWO promotions in my own company because I am not Spanish. I live in a mixed neighborhood and **MY** house is targetted for people throwing garbage and vandalism because my wife andI are white.

I'm Pagan and my wife is Wiccan. We've lost count the number of times we've been told we're going to burn in hell for hour Satansitic beliefs, our heathen beliefs. We're asked if we breed dogs so we can have live animal sacrafices from the puppies. I have Christain fanatics at my door every weekend demanding we convert (I'm about to call the cops on these people - what ever happened to religious freedom?). OUR OWN FUCKING VICE PRESIDENTAL CANDIDATE took part in a ceremony to help demonize Wicca - her own pastor called for the executaion of all Wiccans (he used the term witch but a witch is a Wiccan priestess / follower).

Guess what? We all deal with shit like this - you're not special or different. All we can do is try to educate those who will listen and the fundamentalists will continue to live in their own little hypocritical world.

[Bloodsoul]

"This town country needs an enema!"

[Hobbs]

Please, oh please God, allow me a different flag... give me Canada, give me Britain, hell, give me Spain... any of those places are more equality minded than the average American that I've met.

Then get out. I ain't stopping you. Just so you know, there are plenty of "second-class" citizens such as yourself who proudly serve their country, and when they die, their coffins are draped by the flag of the United States.

[the_std]

Hobbs, are you saying that if someone isn't willing to die for their country, they're not patriotic? What is the relevance of such "second-class citizens" dying for their country, hm?

[telecom_goddess]

Sadly Raps, Britain et al won't grant me a permanent visa because I have no desirable skills (yet).

How does that work? Is it really that difficult to immigrate to England? I'm ignorant on this subject sorry....

[the_std]

It is super difficult to immigrate anywhere that is a first-world country. The two "easiest" ways are... Either you have a significant other to come over with, or you have a skill set required for a particular job that the employer cannot find in their own country.

If you have no specialized training or abilities, you'd better hope you've got a hubby from wherever you want to go.

[Hobbs]

Hobbs, are you saying that if someone isn't willing to die for their country, they're not patriotic? What is the relevance of such "second-class citizens" dying for their country, hm?

The fact that there are gays in the military, that more than likely they've been deployed, and that there is also a fair cahnce some died. The military doesn't keep track of statistics like that for obvious reasons.

I'm saying that, while smileyeagle sees his country in such a bad light, there are others in the same boat who, instead of spouting hate and blame towards those that hate them, prove them wrong by serving honorably. I think that Draggar and Mcdreidel made good points; that this is a country where laws and conditions of discrimination can be changed. In the 1950's and 60's, the discriminated group was African-Americans. In the 60's and 70's it was Hispanics. Even though discrimination still occurs, there are federal laws to protect those groups. The Joint Chiefs have even announced an ending to DADT in the military, and I don't see it being a long time before anti-discrimination laws for homosexuals is passed. So rather than flaming my country, I hope in the nature of my country in prevailing against intolerance, as it has in the past. I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles that made my country free. I will trust in my God, and in the United States of America.

[the_std]

Who says that smiley doesn't try to bring about change? Even though he rants here, he might be involved with rights groups. How do you know? How does gay people dying in the military mean smiley is doing nothing but complain? Also, your addition of trusting in your God as well as the USA to your little tag line there is part of the problem that smiley is talking about. What does God have to do with your patriotism?

[telecom_goddess]

It is super difficult to immigrate anywhere that is a first-world country. The two "easiest" ways are... Either you have a significant other to come over with, or you have a skill set required for a particular job that the employer cannot find in their own country.

If you have no specialized training or abilities, you'd better hope you've got a hubby from wherever you want to go.

So how do performers like Madonna or whoever manage to find homes in places like the UK? It's not like she doesn't have a skill that people there don't already posess lol. I am confused about that.

Plus what kind of super skills do you have to have?

[Hobbs]

Who says that smiley doesn't try to bring about change? Even though he rants here, he might be involved with rights groups. How do you know? How does gay people dying in the military mean smiley is doing nothing but complain? Also, your addition of trusting in your God as well as the USA to your little tag line there is part of the problem that smiley is talking about. What does God have to do with your patriotism?

He's talking about leaving his country. When there's a problem, if you want to help, you don't run away and abandon your fellow countrymen.

It's the sixth Code of Conduct.

[the_std]

Telecom, I couldn't tell you. I'm not an immigration specialist, I'm just repeating what I was told by an immigration lawyer when I looked into getting a visa to live in Scotland.

[the_std]

... You're blaming smiley for not wanting to take the abuse set out by those same countrymen that he'd be "abandoning"? Not everyone is strong, not everyone can make waves or change the world. That doesn't make them bad people.

No response about the God bit?

[Hobbs]

... You're blaming smiley for not wanting to take the abuse set out by those same countrymen that he'd be "abandoning"? Not everyone is strong, not everyone can make waves or change the world. That doesn't make them bad people.

No response about the God bit?

I explained the God bit, pay attention.

[Hobbs]

Here's an explanation of the sixth CoC.

A member of the Armed Forces remains responsible for personal actions at all times. Article VI is designed to assist members of the Armed Forces to fulfill their responsibilities and survive captivity with honor. The CoC does not conflict with the UCMJ, which continues to apply to each military member during captivity or other hostile detention. Failure to adhere to the CoC may subject Service members to applicable disposition under the UCMJ.

When repatriated, POWs can expect their actions to be subject to review, both as to circumstances of capture and as to conduct during detention. The purpose of such review is to recognize meritorious performance and, if necessary, investigate any allegations of misconduct.

Such reviews shall be conducted with due regard for the rights of the individual and consideration for the conditions of captivity.

A member of the Armed Forces who is captured has a continuing obligation to resist all attempts at indoctrination and remain loyal to the United States.

The life of a POW may be very hard. POWs who stand firm and united against enemy pressures shall aid one another immeasurably in surviving this ordeal.

[the_std]

I am paying attention. Are you perhaps referring to "the Sixth Code of Conduct"? I'm sorry, I'm not an American, I've never been in the military, could you perhaps explain that to me? I'd like to know what you're talking about.

Edit: Upon review of your 6th CoC quote, there is nothing about God in there. So, again I ask what that has to do with anything.