Written up!

[Plaidman]

Your going to call health inspector because they wrote you up for being an unexcused absence? Wow. Remind me never to serve you soda with fizz. You might think I spat in it or something.

Look, it's a responsible person's job to know what their job status is. I'm saying you need to call every five minutes, but if you want to protect yourself, then you need to know what your status is at work. Never assume anything.

Go ahead and argue about that lack of verbal detail, and the lack of notice for the job change.

I'm sure you won't have to worry about doing 12 hour shifts for much longer, it be cut down to eight.

Then maybe even less.

[protege]

Getting into this a bit late...I thought I should mention this. I've posted about Kelly before, about how she was taking every Monday or Friday off for various "illnesses." For those who don't know, she was calling in on Friday and/or Monday mornings because her children were "sick," or various things "broke" in her apartment. Never failed at least twice a month, she'd do that.

The final straw snapped, when she started calling in about 3 hours after the "illness," forcing the rest of us to do her work. Not that she did much to begin with...but it was still annoying having that crap dumped on us. Anyway, after one too many 3-hour "no calls," my boss had enough. He simply told her to knock it off, or she'd be looking for another job. Even though she was hourly and didn't get *any* sick time, he was tired of it. It wasn't fair to the rest of us.

I mean, taking a sick day once and awhile is fine. Deciding you want a 3-day weekend every other week...is not.

[DrFaroohk]

I understand about taking sick days to get 3 day weekends - I've been stuck in more double or even triple shifts than I care to remember.

My sick days have been genuine - I know I'm supposed to get a doc note, but I can't afford it until my health insurance kicks in and I already know I'm sick, I don't need a doctor to tell me that, because I know my own body. I know when I've got a fever without a thermometer to tell me. I know when I'm not going to be able to complete a full day because my back or hands can't take the extra stress.

And I realize that management has to take steps when they don't have the proper documentation - I get that. But they didn't take all the steps. Why do they get to skip steps?

All I'm really disputing in my letter to them is going to be 1 - 2 days tops. I'm willing to accept that 3 of my absences were unexcused, and to me that's quite perfectly clear, and to them it will be perfectly clear as well after they read my letter.

So if they continue with my writeup even after it has been made perfectly clear to them, then my honest to god belief here is that they are screwing with me. Most likely their mindset is gonna be "Well, this guy is right, but if we agree with him it'll make us look bad, so let's procede."

I don't know if that's exactly what they're thinking or not. Maybe they'll just think "This guy thinks he's pretty smart, lets keep the writeup just to teach him a lesson. Bring him down a few notches."

Whatever the case may be...you just don't fuck with DrFaroohk. If every last detail of the writeup were legit, we wouldn't be having this conversation. If they'd followed all the proper steps, if they'd been doing their job, I'd have signed the writeup and never thought twice about it. But that's not what happened. They fucked up and they fucked with me, and I'm hoping they have the sense to fix it before it gets worse.

[Plaidman]

HOW did they fuck with you? Other then not give you a verbal warning?

[Fryk]

If it's in their policy that they HAVE TO (and make sure it really is "have to") give you a verbal warning first, and they didn't, then that's all the fucking with you I need to hear about you. Take that to HR, and there's a chance they'll strike the written from your record. BUT--- take extra care from here on out, because that will be the only "rules lawyering" card you'll get to play there, guaranteed.

[Nyoibo]

So when was it that we no longer have to take personal responsibility for our actins or to keep track of them?

Because I've got to catch up on placing the blame on someone else for my own actions.

[Plaidman]

If it's in their policy that they HAVE TO (and make sure it really is "have to") give you a verbal warning first, and they didn't, then that's all the fucking with you I need to hear about you. Take that to HR, and there's a chance they'll strike the written from your record. BUT--- take extra care from here on out, because that will be the only "rules lawyering" card you'll get to play there, guaranteed.

Indeed. If policy states that they may get a verbral warning, then that's pretty much it. Or if the handbook later states that by reading this you will accept that any of it can be changed at anytime without notice, or some may be excempt from certain things. I know that our handbook throw in stupid wording all over the place ><.

[Hobbs]

I understand about taking sick days to get 3 day weekends - I've been stuck in more double or even triple shifts than I care to remember.

My sick days have been genuine - I know I'm supposed to get a doc note, but I can't afford it until my health insurance kicks in and I already know I'm sick, I don't need a doctor to tell me that, because I know my own body. I know when I've got a fever without a thermometer to tell me. I know when I'm not going to be able to complete a full day because my back or hands can't take the extra stress.

And I realize that management has to take steps when they don't have the proper documentation - I get that. But they didn't take all the steps. Why do they get to skip steps?

All I'm really disputing in my letter to them is going to be 1 - 2 days tops. I'm willing to accept that 3 of my absences were unexcused, and to me that's quite perfectly clear, and to them it will be perfectly clear as well after they read my letter.

So if they continue with my writeup even after it has been made perfectly clear to them, then my honest to god belief here is that they are screwing with me. Most likely their mindset is gonna be "Well, this guy is right, but if we agree with him it'll make us look bad, so let's procede."

I don't know if that's exactly what they're thinking or not. Maybe they'll just think "This guy thinks he's pretty smart, lets keep the writeup just to teach him a lesson. Bring him down a few notches."

Whatever the case may be...you just don't fuck with DrFaroohk. If every last detail of the writeup were legit, we wouldn't be having this conversation. If they'd followed all the proper steps, if they'd been doing their job, I'd have signed the writeup and never thought twice about it. But that's not what happened. They fucked up and they fucked with me, and I'm hoping they have the sense to fix it before it gets worse.

Why are you disputing days? Didn't you just own up to being absent all those days and not getting an excuse? It's pretty much concrete evidence if you were excused or not, so how can you dispute it?

My mindset, as management, would be more along the lines, "This guy's quibbling about this? Seriously?" <Checks notes> "He's been absent X days; that's a write-up...gonna make a note in his file. IF he quibbles about this, imagine something more serious than unexcused no-shows."

Rules and policies are not a two-way street. That'd be like me saying to my CO, "Yeah, cheating isn't allowed, but at the time I didn't think it was relevant to me..." Think I'll get cut slack?

[DrFaroohk]

By cheating I assume you mean on your spouse, so how about this one:

You get caught with another woman, which isn't allowed, because your still married right? But you got divorced! Only problem is the court fucked up and didn't process the paperwork right so technically you're still married, but no one - not the court, the judge, your lawyer, no one, ever told you about someone else's fuck up.

What I mean by "two way street" is this: If you make a rule, you must abide by it as well. Even though it's your rule and your property and your business. Don't want to abide by it? Don't make the fucking rule. Also, if a rule is in place, the opposite must also apply. If the rule is that no one in a red shirt is allowed in your house, then the rule must ALSO be that anyone NOT wearing a red shirt must be allowed in.

Of course, no one can force you to behave this way because we live in a free country. But failing to follow the two way street rule makes you into an asshole. And assholes are fair game as far as I'm concerned. So yeah, I have no qualms about screwing someone who's screwing me. Gonna screw me over on some missed days? I'll screw you over with the health inspector or the department of labor. What's the old saying? Turnabout is fair play or something like that? I'm just doing my job after all! It's my duty to report these things!

Or we can just pretend the writeup never happened, and I'm broken in to the job a little more now and I doubt I'll be sick any time soon, and you get to keep your fucking factory open.

That's about it.

[Hobbs]

I wasn't talking about carnal knowledge, but rather, cheating in an academic sense. In either case, I would still be held accountable and punished as per the UCMJ.

The health inspector is nothing but petty vindictiveness. It'd be like me doing a DoS attack on CS. (for the record, I'd never do that. this is just an example).

So you're saying that, at no time, did someone, even in passing, say something along the lines of, "You need an excuse absence/doctor's note next time/don't be absent again."?

[DrFaroohk]

I wasn't talking about carnal knowledge, but rather, cheating in an academic sense. In either case, I would still be held accountable and punished as per the UCMJ.

The health inspector is nothing but petty vindictiveness. It'd be like me doing a DoS attack on CS. (for the record, I'd never do that. this is just an example).

So you're saying that, at no time, did someone, even in passing, say something along the lines of, "You need an excuse absence/doctor's note next time/don't be absent again."?

That's exactly what I'm saying. Not even in a group setting i.e. "Hey, a lot of people here have missed several days, so watch yourselves you're getting close to a writeup."

As for the health inspector - I don't believe there's anything wrong with making legit reports. I could report the bugs I see crawling around, or the oversaturation of chlorine in the ice, or the fact that people are constantly dropping things on the floor and then just picking them back up like nothing happened (MAJOR NO NO). Petty vindictiveness would be making shit up, or sabotaging it myself.

Of course, the PROPER way to handle such issues would be to first bring them to the attention of my superiors..."Hey, we got bugs in the fish." Would be nice if there world worked that way, wouldn't it? But apparently it doesn't, and I'm under no obligation to give anyone any type of warning.

[the_std]

Of course, the PROPER way to handle such issues would be to first bring them to the attention of my superiors..."Hey, we got bugs in the fish." Would be nice if there world worked that way, wouldn't it? But apparently it doesn't, and I'm under no obligation to give anyone any type of warning.

The mentality that you're under no obligation to give your higher-ups any type of warning is childish. Why not let them know so they can fix the problem before you sic the health department on them? Do you have any reason besides revenge? If you let them know, they might be able to fix it quietly and cheaply. If the health department comes down, that means major fines, an interruption in your work flow, the possible loss of jobs or hours. That makes life suck for everyone. Yes, if you tell them and they refuse to do anything about it, that's when the health department should step in. But going through the proper channels first has the potential to keep everything from blowing up.

It's interesting that you're saying that your bosses need to tell you that so many unexcused absences are a bad thing. You've been at this job a couple of months and already have that many stacked up? That makes it seem like you don't care about this job and have no consideration for your bosses. Yep, it sucks that they skipped a step, but that doesn't negate the fact that they're within their right to punish you. Your train of thought sounds like a teenager's. "I can't believe you stole dad's beer! That's wrong!" "Well, you never told me not to, so I thought it was okay!" You definitely know better but you're trying to get out of a problem you caused.

[DrFaroohk]

You've got my train of thought all wrong.

Apparently everyone does. I've written this out a few times but no one gets it.

So lets do it again, because I love to repeat myself.

My main argument is that two of the days are ambiguous. The first day - I was not given proper notice. I explained this to them. I need time to prepare, to adjust my schedule and find fucking babysitters. When I don't get off work until 9p.m., and I have to have someone here at my house with the kids by 6 at the latest, that's a fucking problem. And it's their problem, because they fucked up. How can I be expected to be responsible for their inability to properly schedule days? And how can one honestly count that as an "unexcused absence"? It was an unscheduled work day brought to my attention at the last minute.

The second day was one where I was NOT absent, I actually came to work and was sent home for being sick and my bosses told me this was fine.

Which brings us to the lack of warning - this led me to believe that those days were in fact not counted against me.

Yeah, I could have checked. Or they could have given me the fucking warning that is clearly stated in company policy. Why have rules if you're not going to follow them?

For your analogy, which is bullshit by the way, how about a better one:

Dad says if you take a beer three times he'll ground you. Then he grounds you after you take 2 beers, because yesterday he asked you to get him a beer so you got him one, and he counted that as taking one.

[Hobbs]

You were absent, and didn't have an excuse...that's the criterion for an unexcused absense.

They're not your parents. You think somethings wrong, you go act like a big boy and do some legwork, figure it out.

[Plaidman]

Speaking of being like a teenager. You know something's wrong. You feel you have no obligation to tell higher ups about it.

Well, the book has the rules. You have read book. They're under no obligation ether to warn you about your missed days. They're under no obligation to find babysitters. They say when you have to work, and you go. Your homelife is not their concern at all. Something that book likely states too that you may be called in at short notice. Something you agreed to do when you first signed up under all those forms likely.

Is it fair? Nope. Does it suck? Yep. Is it like real world? Yep. Welcome to being an adult.