"Pun" threads

[Antipsych]

And I hate it when people post and post about a spelling or grammer error.

Plaidman, you ignorant fool! I was wondering if you misspelled that deliberately just to see who would take the bait.

Of course, either way, I had to jump on that.

[Racket_Man]

I searched for a couple of the threads I started that devolved into "let's nitpick this vent/situation".

I did notice one very interesting thing. one or two of the more active members were the ones who started in with the nitpicking, finger wagging and basically telling me that the mysterious "some other person" was "real" and should be believed and bowed down to or to have my company fix the problem (where they were the ones who create the problem in the first place) or they assumed I got nasty with a customer when I did not.

somewhere near the bottom of the replies Raps actaully had to intervein with a reminder of the board rules as I had posted at least 2 or 3 replies trying to defend what my complaint was and lay the blame (for the nitpicking and where it belonged far from the original topic of my OP). I strayed very far OT in defending myself.

yet I frequently read threads started by these members who whine and complain about upper management and their failure to see logic or business sense, or the decenancy to get rid of low performing/slacker/jerkoff employees, etc. but it seems to me one one dares to nitpick on them

[Mongo Skruddgemire]

Honestly I have no problems with the puns and jokes.

Part of the reason that I enjoyed CS.com was the fact that a person could post the worst bits of their day and get some cheering up. To me, a classic example is when someone posts their tale of woe and someone cracks a joke, and the original poster says something to the effect of "Oh that's too funny, thanks I needed that."

That's one of the things that CS is good for. Having someone read your woe, see the humor in the situation and then pass that humor back to you so you can see it in the light of the absurd. It helps get over the stress when someone can show you the humor in a situation that has you so wound up that you yourself cannot.

I know that I do not speak for everyone there. But there are many of us who use CS that way. I did it for my wife since at the time we didn't have high-speed access at home and she didn't DARE post those stories herself from her work since the sysadmin-wannabe watched all traffic like a demented hawk.

Besides, we're already being limited to how we can reply to the posts. We have to be damn some careful about how we refer to other people for fear of offending someone. If we can no longer make jokes about the posts, then the only thing left for us to do is to make "yes men" posts where we simply say "Yes that sucks. That person's behavior is rather unpleasant and baffling as to how the person could think that acting that way and asking for the impossible is somehow going to be effective"

And if we're left with that...then might as well turn off reply postings and just let people post the stories and have others read them in silence.

Which would kill off the popularity of the CS environment in my opinion.

[Rapscallion]

There's a herd mentality in 'failing to see the suck'. It's a cultural drift. Every so often we have to clamp down on every post being subjected to absolute scrutiny and the poster being told that it wasn't that much of an issue.

The place is there for people to vent and support each other. We do slacken it off every so often, but we don't announce it. Every so often we have to reign it in.

Fair enough, Mongo - where would you draw the line? Would you allow people to chase each other off the site? That's what happens without restrictions.

Rapscallion

[Ree]

Seriously, I have no problem with a joke or two.

I think it's great to see a post showing the humor in the situation, and members trying to cheer another up.

What I have an issue with is when the entire thread devolves into nothing but jokes and people trying to outdo each other with silly puns, especially when the replies are nothing but puns, and the members haven't even offered a single word of support to the OP, or even recognized the sucky situation for what it is.

When I see that, I wonder if the person has even bothered to read the OP or has just jumped on the "pun" bandwagon.

If the members were posting the puns, and then adding actual words of support to the OP, that would be one thing, but that is not what was happening.
As I mentioned, when I started this thread to vent, a member had practically apologized for posting an actual on topic comment in the midst of pages of nothing but puns.

As for failing to see the suck, if there had not been a need for it, we would not have started clamping down.

I have mentioned before that even I used to point out to the OP when I felt their own actions contributed to the situation.
There was a bit of a board mentality that the customer was the enemy...period!

I was reading a lot of posts by people who really had no business in customer service, and they were writing as if the customer was completely unreasonable for expecting them to do the job they were being paid to do.

All of their threads were almost identical repeat situations with only slight changes in the scenario.
When I see those types of threads where everyone is out of step except the OP, I have to wonder if it's something they are doing wrong.

I started to point it out and offer constructive comments on ways that they could prevent those same situations in the future.
Personally, I still see nothing wrong with that.
Unfortunately, we are dealing with people, and there are always going to be those who take it to the extreme.

It got to the point where we had to clamp down, because people stopped discerning between a member who had just had a really bad day with a truly sucky customer, and a member whose own poor attitude and sadly lacking customer service skills had escalated the situation.

Everyone was getting the "fail to see the suck" type lectures.

I know I made a couple of posts, myself, and was lectured to by a couple of people as to why my customers weren't really being sucky as they played "devil's advocate" against me.
I'm sorry, but 30 years in customer service means that I'm pretty good at recognizing suckiness when I see it, and I didn't really need the lessons.

I let it go, though, but then the mods started getting PM's and reported posts from people who were sick and tired of the lectures.
Some even threatened to stop posting entirely.
(In fact, I know of several people who never post any sucky customer stories anymore and are barely even active on the site at all, simply because of "failing to see the suck" comments made to them on their threads.)

That was when the mods said, "Enough!"

It may seem petty and to those who have been called on that type of behaviour, I'm sure it stings a bit, but until you have been behind the scenes and know the reason for it, you are just going to have to trust us that we don't put rules in place and clamp down on members without good reason.

[Hobbs]

I know I did it. But once I was reminded (I think it was you, Ree, and Raps if I'm not mistaken) about failing to see the suck and I eventually found it in the Site News, I stopped. I'm glad it got posted in the Site Rules sticky afterwards.

[Dips]

I don't mind a joke or two. Some jokes posted in my threads have made me laugh.

Even the puns are usually funny at first, but the longer they go on the more unfunny they become. When people have to strain that hard to top the last guy the jokes become about as repetitive and unfunny as customers saying "It must be free."

As for failing to see the suck. What Raps said. You would get a mob mentality developing from time to time that ruins the fun for everyone and drives people away.

Often the people suffering the most from it were new members posting their first story.

The site is not going to do well if we drive off new members by nitpicking them.

[Hobbs]

However, what if it's a story that even a layman can see is not sucky, and is due to the OP being a bad CSR? If that were to happen, would a comment towards the OP be considered Fail to see the suck? I remember one thread like that, and I remember someone (might have been an Old-Timer and not necessarily a Mod) giving them a good brow-beat for it.

[HYHYBT]

I know you haqve your reasons, but if you're going to have a blanket rule against "failing to see the suck" that doesn't even allow for *asking politely* why the OP thought it was sucky, then you logically ought also to have a rule against posting about situations that cannot rationally be viewed as sucky in any way at all. And yes, any situation where someone does something that affects nobody but themselves in the least should qualify

[Plaidman]

Plaidman, you ignorant fool! I was wondering if you misspelled that deliberately just to see who would take the bait.

Of course, either way, I had to jump on that.

Only took 40 posts before someone noticed too...


I wonder if I should be in customer service. I'm not very nice to alot of the jackasses that push my buttons.

[Mongo Skruddgemire]

I don't mind a joke or two. Some jokes posted in my threads have made me laugh.

Even the puns are usually funny at first, but the longer they go on the more unfunny they become. When people have to strain that hard to top the last guy the jokes become about as repetitive and unfunny as customers saying "It must be free."

But how to quantify it. How does one come up with a fair system to say that "X" is funny while "Y" isn't.

Example. Someone posted a story of someone who returned a toolbox because it had a handle. Many people would find that a bit odd and most of them would be baffled by the logic behind the return.

So I posted in agreement over the "hard to wrap your brain around" situation by posting...

"It was as if millions of brain cells cried out and were suddenly silenced."

It could be argued that it was irrelevant to the OP, it could also be argued that it was a humorous way of saying "Gee, I agree that the logic there (or lack thereof) was of a type as to cause a headache from trying to fathom it."

Two ways to look at it. 50/50 odds of offending someone, 50/50 odds of tickling someone's funny bone and making their day.

Who is right? Where does that post fit in?

I agree that it can get thick in there pretty quickly. Hell I have a child who hasn't learned when to drop a joke because it isn't funny after the 23'rd telling much less the 43'rd. But how to quantify it? Aye, that's the rub.

[Lace Neil Singer]

The thing is, I don't mind people posting humourous responses, that's not really a problem. What is a problem is when the thread gets hijacked by the punners and ends up being pages and pages of bullshit, none of which is funny. Maybe a "three strikes" rule, as in three puns yes, but any more no?

I will say again about the nitpicking. I posted a thread of rants about rude customers and it really annoyed me that both the people who replied just replied to nitpick me. I wondered if they'd even bothered reading my post, and it put me off from making threads to be honest.

[Ree]

Example. Someone posted a story of someone who returned a toolbox because it had a handle. Many people would find that a bit odd and most of them would be baffled by the logic behind the return.

So I posted in agreement over the "hard to wrap your brain around" situation by posting...

"It was as if millions of brain cells cried out and were suddenly silenced."

It could be argued that it was irrelevant to the OP, it could also be argued that it was a humorous way of saying "Gee, I agree that the logic there (or lack thereof) was of a type as to cause a headache from trying to fathom it."

Two ways to look at it. 50/50 odds of offending someone, 50/50 odds of tickling someone's funny bone and making their day.

Where are the headdesk, wall banging, deadhorse smileys when you need them?
Seriously.
That's why the site has moderators.
It's their job to do the filtering.
Unfortunately, that seems to be the real issue.
A moderator did their job and someone has taken issue with it.

If you make a post, and nothing happens to it, you don't get a PM from a mod, and there's absolutely no editing done, obviously there was no problem.

If you post something that crosses the line, it will be edited and you will get a PM...and there's still no problem.

It's only a freakin' website.
Having a moderator slap your hand doesn't go on your permanent record.
It won't bar you from further employment, for crying out loud.

For the umpteenth time, nobody is taking any freakin' issue with jokes.

I made this thread to vent about all the threads that had started to derail into nothing but puns.
I was very clear to state that I was NOT posting as a moderator, but as a member venting about something that bugged me.

Did anyone receive any infractions or PM's, or have any of the threads been closed down or deleted as a result of this thread, or their jokes and puns?
NO!

There have been more than a few puns and joking comments posted since I vented here.
Nothing was done to stop them.

Obviously we are not going to have any type of ruling on jokes and puns.

There's nothing wrong with them.

End of story.

My hope, however, is that, along with their silly stuff, perhaps those who are notorious for only making puns and joking comments might actually contribute something of worth to the threads in the future.

As for the failing to see the suck, it's very obvious that some will never get it.
We've explained our reasons.

If a person genuinely posts something out of confusion, and a moderator does take it as them "failing to see the suck" it's not the end of the world.
If you PM a moderator and explain your side, we don't hold it against you.
That doesn't always guarantee your post will go back up, though.
If, however, the same person continues to post the same type of questioning posts, then it's pretty damned obvious to the mods that the failing to see the suck line is being crossed deliberately.

I know I recently posted something to a member who seems to always have the very same scenario in every thread posted. It could have been taken as failing to see the suck, I know. That is why I very clearly stated that I was not failing to see the suck, as the customer had very clearly behaved badly.
My concern was that, if every single one of his customers goes off the deep end within seconds of his greeting, wouldn't it stand to reason that this member is the common denominator rather than assuming that all of his customers are insane? Wouldn't it be rational to conclude that there must be something in his approach that is putting people off?
To me, we should be able to offer constructive advice like that if we feel we can help the member out. Nobody likes to see a fellow member getting verbally beaten up every single day and with every single customer.

Unfortunately, as has already been stated repeatedly, some people will always take it too far.

Not only that, but with a name like "CustomersSuck" we have always been a real target for customers dressed in sheep's clothing to come in and stir up trouble. Having that rule in place is necessary for that reason alone, but I think we have explained other very valid reasons as well.

Bottom line is, just keep posting and let the mods do the heavy lifting.
If they call you on something, don't get so bent out of shape and act as if they have the members names on a dartboard and yours came up that day as someone we just felt like picking on.

[blas87]

Can I offer some ways of looking at this?

You start a brand new job today. The moment you walk into the door and introduce yourself and then take break with your new coworkers, they are instantly nitpicking everything you wear, say, or do. Would you want to continue working there if every day you were scrutizinized like that?

The same goes for new posters who post a story and then get nitpicked and questioned to death.

Or a little closer to home, CS. Let's pretend I'm PizzaGirl87 and I work at Dominos. I post after a long weekend of their recent promotion of their 12 inch pizzas for $3.99, and my never ending list of customers who thought it was the largest pizzas and got all nasty with me and called me names and threw money at me and slammed the door and threatened to never order from Dominos again.

I get some replies and see that other members have asked me "Well, what if they'd never eaten at Dominos before and didn't know what sizes were what?" or "What if your ads had been misleading?"

You'd be pretty pissed, or at the very least a little down because not a single person said "Man, that sucks." or at the very least, let you know that you weren't alone, that swearing and yelling is childish, etc etc etc etc etc etc.

Idk, I just feel a little energy left in me before bed and felt the need to try to argue the point that Raps and the mods are not in the wrong here, and also that none of them ever said no one was allowed to politely ask for clarification if they are truly confused about the details of the story.

[Ree]

Can I offer some ways of looking at this?

You start a brand new job today. The moment you walk into the door and introduce yourself and then take break with your new coworkers, they are instantly nitpicking everything you wear, say, or do. Would you want to continue working there if every day you were scrutizinized like that?

Or, as in the case that was my reason for starting this thread, how would you feel if they spent the whole day making nothing but jokes and puns over the first words out of your mouth?

YOU: How do you do?
THEM: I dodo very well.
Where's the doodoo?
Don't get that doodoo on me.
Yeah, cause you wouldn't want to have a crappy day.
Oh, yeah, that would be just shitty!
And we wouldn't want the shit to hit the fan.
HYUK HYUK!!!

YOU: Ummm...well I will just be over here at my desk not saying anything else. Thanks for making me feel so welcome. Glad you could have a laugh at my expense.