The Asses Are Talking Again

[blas87]

Dear lord, I thought asses were for shitting, not talking. Oh wait....it's coming out of their mouth. It's the verbal shits!

So, anyone who isn't already aware, my work place is going smoke-free as of the beginning of January. Sure, it'll be a real adjustment and understandably, many people are upset. More people there smoke than don't smoke. And to clarify, please read this thoroughly before responding: NO smoking will be allowed on company property, that includes your vehicle, the parking lot, we are not allowed to leave the premises on break. So you can't smoke there at all, period.

We knew about this almost 6 months ago, and yet people are still puntificating that they are going to quit working there, or they are going to still smoke in their cars anyway (despite a warning from the higher ups that standard discipline protocal will apply to people caught smoking and security will be watching).

I was upset when I first heard it as well, and I can understand why lots of people are up in arms about it. I just cannot excuse or justify the puntificating or the ass-talking and empty threats.

Thank heavens the Gods have silenced my lips, because I want to laugh at these people. I want to ask "How are you going to afford cigarettes at $7-$8 a pack if you don't have a job?" "So you are going to quit your full time job with benefits and overtime opportunities because you won't be able to smoke for 8 to 12 hours?" "Have fun affording cigarettes when the only job opportunities around here are in customer service and the food industry, that's nearly 3 dollars less than what you make here.....plus those places don't allow overtime, so forget extra money!"

I think they are really convinced that they won't get in trouble if they get caught smoking. We were threatened that you could even be terminated for it (I'd assume that would be if you were caught more than once, though, because more than half of the staff wouldn't work there anymore if you were fired for one offense).

The economy is slowly improving, but it's still an employer's market. Jobs are still really scarce here. No other factory jobs for the most part, or other higher paying full time/benefit package jobs. Do you really want the reason you were fired to be because you were smoking in your car? I don't think unemployment covers that.

The cherry on the cake is that it's the people who bitch the most about being broke or needing extra cash that are the most hell-bound on quitting working there because of the smoking ban.
Idiots.

[HYHYBT]

It's just venting; naturally the ones the most trapped in a situation they don't like complain the most.

(And stopping people from smoking *even in their cars on break* is just stupid. The *only* purpose that serves is to make trouble for smokers.)

[blas87]

I do agree with that very much, because as long as they aren't littering, I don't see the problem.

It's saving money on insurance policies, and it all boils down to money and everyone having to strive to be healthy

The first few weeks are going to be a complete disaster, I am quite certain that there will be tears, blood, and hair shed all over the place.

[telecom_goddess]

Time to bust out electronic cigs and stealth vape....there is no way they would know.

ETA: So you can't leave on lunch either? which is your UNPAID time? That's bs...and I think making it impossible for people to smoke at all during the day is ridiculous.

[blas87]

All of our breaks are paid because they aren't 15 or 30 minute breaks, so we don't punch out, and if we can't punch out, we can't leave the premises.

By the way, E-ciggs are included in the ban because the FDA hasn't approved them and they mimick the act of smoking itself. Well, that's the line we were fed anyway. Behh. Whatever. Fine.

[Rageaholic]

I don't smoke, but that sounds like a bullshit policy. I hate control freaks, especially when they are in charge of something.

[BlaqueKatt]

Do you really want the reason you were fired to be because you were smoking in your car? I don't think unemployment covers that.

no but the wrongful termination lawsuit would cover it.

quite simply put your job did NOT do it's homework.

WI State Statutes 111.31-111.395-fair employment.

prohibits discrimination because of use or non-use of lawful products.

As tobacco is a lawful product-your Employer is in violation of the law, and subject to heavy fines from the DWD because of it-Tell the whiners to take it up with the equal rights division of the DWD.

[Andara Bledin]

Thanks for finding that, BK. I knew there were several states that have enacted laws to protect lawful use of controversial products during personal time.

However, in the case of Blas' work, they can prohibit its use while on company property.

However, I'm fairly certain that they cannot prevent employees from taking their provided rest period and choosing to forgo being paid for that time, and instead clocking out and leaving the premises to have a quick smoke. However, I would consult the local labor board before trying to put that to the test.

The same goes for within a parked vehicle. While outside the vehicle is the property of the company, I'm fairly certain that inside the vehicle, particularly if the windows are up, is entirely the property of the owner/possessor of said vehicle.

^-.-^

[aurelemsrealm]

I understand what Blas is saying about people running off at the mouth because they are pissed off over such a stupid company policy. It serves no purpose to run off at the mouth, even if the counter position is assinine.

I believe the company has gone too far dictating that employees are not allowed to smoke inside their own vehicles on their breaks. I wouldn't bitch and moan about the nonsense because that would only draw undue attention. However, if I decided I wanted a cigarette, I would go smoke in my vehicle while on break. If they caught me, and decided to reprimand me for it, then I would tell them my exact opinion of the policy.

[Ginger Tea]

I've worked in 3 places with a restrictive non smoking policy
the first a cake bakery, smoking allowed on allocated breaks in the smoke hut at the far end of the car park.

Next an electrostatic powder coating company with 7 max employees, all but myself and the new lad who got stick cos his mum worked in the office of the parent company smoked.
We lost our smoking on the job privilages when one of the powder coaters lit a rag full of paint thinner on fire, whilst the new lad was holding it.

Finally my current employment, as we are located on the grounds of an NHS trust and the whole of the NHS went smoke free about 3 years ago, we lost the bike shed as a smoke hut, but 3 years later and there are always fresh butts littering the place and other offices who over look our building have made complaints
"If we can't smoke, why can they?" fair question
Yesterday we had a fire alarm at 05:30 and virtually everyone was smoking in the bike shed and when the supervisor was doing a roll call she didn't see or care about it, even though she was stood right infront of one group. Mind you we arn't allowed to eat in the unit and many years ago "mr. I can get away with blatant sexual harrasment" was eating a sandwich in the high risk area and talking to a supervisor at the same time and he was oblivious to it.

[Plaidman]

I believe the company has gone too far dictating that employees are not allowed to smoke inside their own vehicles on their breaks. I wouldn't bitch and moan about the nonsense because that would only draw undue attention. However, if I decided I wanted a cigarette, I would go smoke in my vehicle while on break. If they caught me, and decided to reprimand me for it, then I would tell them my exact opinion of the policy.

Well guess what? Their precious vehicles being their safetly net? You demand to smoke in your own car all you want. Fine, the company can demand you to move your car off their proptery. You can demand to smoke in your proptery, they can demand you leave it.

Since you left the lot, your considered that you left the job.

Is it fair? Hardly. But perfectly legal.


I do love the fact a decent chunk of smokers in the world always cry out that their being victimised.

These are the same people that will blow smoke in nonsmokers face. The same people that throw their butts in peoples yard or lots and make the owners pick it up. Same people that demand cigs from other people, and get upset and angry if told no, or even start to insult you if you state you don't smoke because your obviously lying.


I have no problem with people that smoke, as long as their polite about it, don't smoke in my face or smoke in my house when I ask you not too. (And I've forcefully kicked out a friend and cut him lose when he refused to do that).

People want to kill themselves by smoking? Go ahead. Just be polite about it. As in, don't throw the butts on the ground. Don't smoke in people's face.

(Now here is a BIG FAT notice before I get people screaming down my throat as I know there will be)

There are two types of people that smoke in face.

A: The people that sit down next to someone and start smoking, and if person complains, the smoker laughs and tells them it's a free country and they can smoke where they want whenever they want, followed by a big blast of cig smoke in that person's face.
THAT IS BS. That person was there in the first place, and shouldn't be evicted simply because you want to smoke.

and
B: The kind that are smoking, and someone walks by and demands you put out the smoke. The smokers at this point should tell that person to fuck off.
Nah, not should. Better. Or have a perfect right. Why? The smoker was smoking first, likely in a place that isn't bothering anyone, and then some asshole demands you put it out? I'm in the smokers side at this point, because it's bs to be told to put it out when it wasn't bothering anyone.


I'm friends with smokers. I hang out with them. They smoke in their house and I'm fine with that.

If they're at my place, they smoke outside. They're fine with that, even if it's winter. Works out great.


People complained about the smoking ban in Bars a few years back. Bar owners were angry because they were going to lose oh so much business.

Nope. Didn't lose anything. If anything they gained customers, because guess what? Even NONsmokers, or people that hate cig smoke, love to drink! So nonsmokers came in drones and drink! The smokers still came to drink, they just had to go outside to smoke!
Bar owners even set up nice big airy booths with heaters to keep it warm, a cover on top (Basically a house with no walls) and plenty of chairs. Smokers still complained.

Because hey, it's total bullshit that a nonsmoker should dare go to a bar. They should fucking drink at home if they hate smoke right? That can be turned around. Smokers should drink at home if they want to smoke. And nonsmokers that hate smoke should never work at a bar, because jobs are ever so easy to get right? Not really. It's hard to get a job, and sometimes a bartending job is the only thing that can pay what they need to survive.

Despite the tirade above, I voted against the smoking ban. I don't smoke, but felt it was poorly written. What I belive what should have been done, is an option. As in, bars can choose to be smoke free or not. Granted, every bar in the entire state would have stayed SMOKER PARADISE then. But if say a nonsmoking bar got a big discount on rent or taxed beer or something, it be better chance.

I'm just tired of smokers acting like they deserve everything and fuck people that choose not to smoke.

Personally, smokes should be a minimal of twenty bucks a pack everywhere, even Indian grounds. Let the a good chunk of the tax go to cancer research.

It works for smokers because they get their precious tobacco, and cancer likely get cured faster so they can smoke even longer without fear of lung cancer. They can even make it so their children don't become addicted to smoking from second hand smoke (Or witnessing how AWESOME it is to smoke since ma and dad and eveyone they know smoke.

Sure, parents claim it bad to smoke, but they normally yelling at the kid to never smoke while they have a ciggerette or two or three in their mouths.



Smoking is a choice yeah, but so many smokers abuse that choice and inflict it on those that choose not too. Be it second hand smoke, the constant badgering for cigs, the guns at clerks heads for cigs, the screaming at clerk because cigs are just too damn expensive, the cig butts littering your front lawn, or their precious snowflake when people start trying to make the air a little fresher and cleaner to be safer for those that don't smoke.

But smokers don't see that. They just see their rights being infrindge on. God forbid they just smoke at home when they're not around anyone. I mean that's just total Bullshit to them that they can't smoke in front of anyone and everyone and blowing it in peoples faces, or shouting how fucking awesome you will be if you start smoking to children who want to be cool and do start it despite how stupid it is and they should know it.

Again, I'm fine with people that smoke, as long as your fucking polite about it. But too many people forget the polite part, and just do what they want.

It's different if I'm at a person that smokes home or in a car with them. That's their car, that's their home. They can smoke in that all they want with me there. I made the choice to visit them then, I deserve the smoke.

People that work at bars that try to be healthy? Not a choice. A job is needed to survive in this world, and if it's the only thing? It's not like a relationship they can leave at anytime despite their complaining, a job is needed to survive in this world. They don't have a choice in that regard.

[blas87]

We don't have much leverage in it because we aren't allowed to punch out for breaks, since they are paid. If you punch out, you cannot punch back in for 8 hours. So if you punch out thinking you can smoke, you'd be in a lot of trouble and have to explain to your boss why you did it, then they'd have to adjust your punch time.....and you'd be disciplined for smoking.

[Plaidman]

Well, the smokers do have choices, from easiest to hardest they are

1: Use a vapor cig. Perfectly legal everywhere, even inside places as it isn't real smoke, and they get the same nicotine as a normal cig.
2: Use nicaton patch or gum.
3: Smoke before you get to work, then smoke when your done with shift. It's only a half a day. Since so many smokers claim they can quit anytime they want, then going 12 hours should be cake.
4: Quit. After all, this place is just totally screwing your precious smoking rights. Despite it being perfectly legal for them to dicate that you cannot smoke on their lot. And since you cant leave the lot during your shift even on breaks since their paid is also legal, because it wasn't something that came in affect with the smoking ban at same time, but was there long before the smoking ban. Yeah, you do have the right to smoke. But places also have the right to say not on my land and place of business. Since smoking harms more then nonsmoking, it's prefectly fine to dicate what protects the most in terms of both people and places. (as in trash on the ground from butts, the yellowing of walls, the higher price the places have to pay for health insureence for the smokers vs nonsmokers, and if it happens at my place of business and my mom's last few places, autcal fist fights and theft of smokes from other employees, it's perfectly natural to choose no smoking anywhere being the easist to handle).

While it may seem unfair, it's only a couple of hours.

It's perfectly legal to drink all you want, but you cannot drink on the job. Do you think that's fair? Alcholics that cannot function without booze in their blood don't agree. But they suffer through their hours until the can hit the bottle the second they clock out, then smokers can easily do the same. Buckle up, it's isn't THAT hard to go a few hours without smoking.


and last in terms of easiest because its one of the most difficult things to do in this world
Reason 6 BILLION option: Quit smoking. Yes, it's hard. Very hard. But there are so many freaking options out there to help quit smoking, that if you really did want to quit, you can. Not being allowed to smoke while on the job can help you achive that goal a little easier.

[Ginger Tea]

Time will tell if the higher up's abide by this ruling too, one supervisor was seen today in the grounds smoking by the storeman and told another supervisor if he wanted to "catch him in the act" all he had to do, to abide by the ban, was go to the roadside.

Which reminds me, once we had the smoking ban, I think alot used to go to the bus shelter across the road, I'm just assuming this as it is now just a bus stop pole now, I think the bus drivers used to get pissed off stopping to not pick up sheltering from the rain workers from the whole grounds.

[blas87]

The higher ups are salaried, they can leave for breaks, so you bet the ones who smoke will leave to smoke.

I'm not the one trying to put up a fight here, I'm not in the mood anymore to fight losing battles. I'm just baffled at the things people will say without even thinking about them.