It's a fictional character - chill the hell out

[PepperElf]

this post from CS. com (about screaming kids) reminded me of this story....


I was on my second ship and they had War of the Worlds playing on the ship's TV system.

I wasn't really paying much attention to it cos I'm not a tom cruise fan but I do remember getting SICK of hearing Dakota Fanning's character SCREAMING constantly. Apparently I wasn't the only one who felt this way. One of the guys suggested that Tom's character should slap her across the face to shut her up. I didn't mind this idea cos... well it's a movie, it's all imaginary, and the screaming really was pretty annoying.




But one of other coworkers - one who ALWAYS plays the "i-have-kids-you-don't card" ... she got FURIOUS with him over it. She would have tried picking a fight but everyone there pretty much knew the best way to stop her "fights" is to just ignore her.

but yeah she was very offended that someone wanted a pretend person slapped. i mean the guys would NEVER do that in real life - no matter how assholish they were. But according to her they were horrible for even thinking about slapping someone who didn't exist.


O_o okaaaay.

[BlaqueKatt]

ok I'm a mom, I'm very tolerant of children, and I WANTED to smack her!

Though as an aside I think she outacted Tom cruise in that movie.....

[Salted Grump]

Katt, a chunk of driftwood could outact Cruise at the apex of his career.

As for the movie; I have no intention of seeing it, simply because I have no love at all for movies that only use kids as Plot macguffins or mobile alarm systems for the zombie hordes. You'd think all that shrieking would lure them right in, wouldn't you?

[lordlundar]

That couldn't have been terribly hard to do. A former manager and I were catching snippets of it being screened in a display room and almost on the floor laughing at just how bad the laws of physics and common sense were butchered for the sake of "excitement". We actually lost track of how many times the characters should have been wiped out, and we didn't even see that much.

[Ipecac Drano]

I don't mind children and I have drawn praise from parents for my patience toward their young'ns, but I still can't get the screams of Newt from Aliens out of my head even after 24½ years.

Dakota's got nothing on her...

[PepperElf]

Katt, a chunk of driftwood could outact Cruise at the apex of his career.

that's what i was thinking too LOL.

[Ree]

Opinions of Tom Cruise's lousy acting and screaming kids aside, I can understand the opinion expressed by the coworker.

It's no secret that I, too, have a soft spot for children, but I don't really feel that figures in here.

I think the comment is just one more example of how movie violence has desensitized us. We see it on the screen, and we know it's not real, but then, when we see it in real life, we are just a bit less shocked by it.

It may well have been a fictional character being referred to, but the idea of slapping a child across the face, even a fictional one seems abhorrent.
That someone could suggest the idea is repulsive to me.

It leaves me with the impression that the person is just a bit too cavalier about violence against another person, especially a child.

Take the child out of this equation, though.

I would feel the same if it was a woman screaming and someone suggested that the character slap her across the face to shut her up.

Fictional or not, I really do not like to see anyone condoning violence as a solution.

[Rageaholic]

I got that too. On a season of 24, someone commented on their relief that a characters schizophrenic daughter was killed off. It was just one of those annoying subplots that didn't serve any purpose other than to "humanize" a character. Well you would have thought that they were the most heartless bastard on the planet. Advocating death against a mentally ill person? How dare they!

This is ignoring the fact that the mentally disabled daughter is FICTIONAL and NOT REAL. Seriously, I'm sure many of those same people would never condone death for being mentally disabled. What their ire was directed at was the STORY that had no place in a television show about counter terrorism. We're not stupid, we can tell the difference between a fictional character who IS NOT REAL and a real live breathing human.

[Andara Bledin]

I think the comment is just one more example of how movie violence has desensitized us. We see it on the screen, and we know it's not real, but then, when we see it in real life, we are just a bit less shocked by it.

This is totally unrelated, though.

It's fantasy violence against a fantasy character.

Babies and animals know the difference between real and fantasy. We never unlearn it no matter how gratuitously violent our fantasy gets.

Hell, re-read the OP. The person in question didn't even suggest that they should slap the character, but that the other character should.

Besides, in a survival situation, I would hope that even you would slap a kid if it meant the kid and you not being horribly killed by whatever was hunting you.

^-.-^

[Ree]

This is totally unrelated, though.

<snip>

Hell, re-read the OP.

Hell, re-read my comment.

I know it's a fictional scenario against a fictional character, and I conceded that, but it's the idea that constant exposure to that type of violent situation makes a person desensitized to it.
I submit your own use of the term "fantasy violence".

"Fantasy violence?
Why?

Besides, in a survival situation, I would hope that even you would slap a kid if it meant the kid and you not being horribly killed by whatever was hunting you.

In the OP, slapping the child across the face was not suggested as a way to silence her to ensure survival. It was suggested as a way to shut her up because her screams were annoying the person watching the movie.

In a survival situation, slapping the child sharply is a way to startle them out of the screaming terror. I probably would not have any issue with that if it meant ensuring our survival.
On the other hand, simply slapping the child across the face to shut up annoying screams because they are getting to me would not be something I could do.

[Rapscallion]

It's fantasy violence against a fantasy character.

I don't accept your point.

Good fiction is a reflection on reality and able to move us. It's supposed to connect with the audience and make them feel.

I'm a grizzled old bastard, but I've had tears in my eyes before after a good scene. I'm no parent, but I felt moved by the opening of the new Star Trek film, for example. The whole birth and sacrifice thing, if you've seen the movie.

Fiction doesn't come into it. Fiction is a mirror to reality.

Rapscallion

[Ree]

Babies and animals know the difference between real and fantasy. We never unlearn it no matter how gratuitously violent our fantasy gets.

I never said we don't unlearn the difference between fantasy and reality, but we humans are a funny bunch in the way that our brains work.
We become creatures of habit.

Take, for example, a building in one's neighbourhood that burns down, killing several people.
On the first day we pass that scene, we see the burned out shell of a building and remember with sadness what a horrible event occurred.
For about a week after that, every time we pass by, we might be reminded, and we think about it.
As each day passes, though, the time spent thinking about it lessens, and our sadness starts to wane.
By the second week, we really aren't noticing it much at all, and we don't even think about the sad event.

After a month, we don't even see the burned out shell, because it has now just become part of the landscape.

In my opinion, it's the same with a mind that is constantly being subjected to violence.
The first time we see it, we are shocked by it, and even bothered. There might be bad dreams about it and some fears manifested.

As time goes on, and we mature, we are exposed to it more often in video games, on TV or in movies, and eventually, we do start to tell ourselves that it's just harmless fiction and these people are not real.

Eventually, we see similar violent acts being reported on the evening news, and we know they aren't fictional people, but we aren't quite as bothered by the horror of it all anymore, unless it happens to hit home with us in that people we know are affected, or it is a violent act of immense magnitude, such as 9/11.

[Andara Bledin]

So.... the consensus is that all those kids running around playing cops and robbers really do want to rob banks and/or shoot and kill their enemies and that violence in media is to blame.

Got it.

^-.-^

[Ree]

So.... the consensus is that all those kids running around playing cops and robbers really do want to rob banks and/or shoot and kill their enemies and that violence in media is to blame.

Ummm...no.
Talk about reaching an illogical conclusion based on only part of a statement.

At no point at all did I say that playing cops and robbers means they want to grow up and act out that "fantasy".
What I am saying, though, is that being constantly exposed to violent situations in their play and in their entertainment makes them a little more blasé about seeing it and it does change how they react to it when they see it in real life.

Kids have been playing "cowboy and Indian" and "cops and robbers" for many years, long before the "media" existed. In fact, in medieval times, I have no doubt that children imitated the knights and gladiators in their play.

You do have to admit, though, that society has advanced to quite a degree, and as a result, people are being exposed to violence earlier and earlier, and in many more forms than they ever have been previously.

We are no longer talking about Wile E. Coyote being bashed on the head or Elmer Fudd blasting Bugs with his shotgun on a TV screen.
Those were pretty easy characters to identify as fantasy.

Now, with graphics being so advanced, the characters being blasted away on computer screens and video games have much more human forms, and the children behind the joysticks or whatever are gaining points for devising creative ways of killing off these humanoid characters.

I am not saying that will guarantee the the kids playing these games will then go out and start blasting away at the people they meet on the street.

What I am saying, (and I think I have made this point several times), is that constant exposure to that type of situation tends to make people a little less shocked by real life violence, and in some cases, they will even advocate violence as a solution to a problem, such as in the case of the OP where the person advocated slapping a child across the face just to shut her up because her screaming bothered him.

[Andara Bledin]

What I am saying, though, is that being constantly exposed to violent situations in their play and in their entertainment makes them a little more blasé about seeing it and it does change how they react to it when they see it in real life.

Actually, studies continue to show that exposure to fantasy violence elicits completely different reactions than exposure to real violence, and that the one doesn't measurably effect the other.

When I have more time, I'll go dig up a few studies to support that.

I'll also dig up studies that show that youth violence declines while reporting of youth violence continues to grow.

I'm notably interested in news that relates to gaming as I'm an avid gamer, and this is something that comes up over and over again and what you're saying tends to be swallowed whole without any actual scientific support.

It's like the idea that sugar makes kids hyper. Some kids might be made hyper by sugar, but it's the observers that are effected and any change in the kids is due to the observers expectations, not the actual effects of sugar.

^-.-^