Anger and hate at politeness

[Boozy]

Ok, I admit it..I am old fashion in somethings. Never raise a hand to a woman unless my or somebody else life is in immediate danger...

In general, I would say that "not beating women" is more of a modern concept than an old-fashioned one.

If you mean, however, that hitting men whenever you want is fine, but women get a free pass as the 'weaker" sex, than yes - that's very old-fashioned, and you should probably think it over.

[Lace Neil Singer]

That still doesn't give a man the right to hit a woman back. The fact is that men are stronger than women, so even if the woman is hitting the man, he should concentrate on restraining her rather than retaliating cuz if he hits her back he could pulverise her. I wouldn't see anything rude or demeaning to women if this guy was holding a woman by the wrists to stop her hitting him; I'd just think she was being a bitch and he was well within his rights to stop her.

[the_std]

That still doesn't give a man the right to hit a woman back. The fact is that men are stronger than women, so even if the woman is hitting the man, he should concentrate on restraining her rather than retaliating cuz if he hits her back he could pulverise her.

I completely and wholeheartedly disagree with this statement. If a woman hits a man, she has given up all rights to any gender-based treatment. I don't believe any man, when confronted with an attack, has a duty to restrain the woman over defending themselves. Should we push this example further and say that men are not allowed to hit men who are smaller and weaker than they are? Or that women should not be allowed to retaliate against smaller women? It's kind of silly.

If someone is demonstrating a lack of respect for humanity by attacking another person, they should be treated equally, no matter what they've got between their legs.

[protege]

handicapped people are over the moon with joy over it...

Not all of them.

When I was in college, I had some bitch (and I'm being nice), in a wheelchair get upset because I dared to open the door for her. Never mind that the door was difficult to open to begin with, and the entryway was covered in ice. Nope, she screamed about how she "wasn't a fucking cripple, and could do it herself." Rather publicly, in fact. I'm sure the entire lobby heard her...because the next day, she couldn't get the door open...and nobody would help her. She could, do it herself, after all

Don't get me wrong, I tend to hold the doors open for people. It sucks getting smacked with a door, or dropping stuff because you can't quite catch the handle, etc. But if I'm being nice, there's no reason to fucking scream at me. Also, if you've been nasty to me in the past, don't expect me to go out of my way to be nice to you.

[Andara Bledin]

I wouldn't see anything rude or demeaning to women if this guy was holding a woman by the wrists to stop her hitting him; I'd just think she was being a bitch and he was well within his rights to stop her.

Tell that to a friend of my brother's who was arrested for taking his soon-to-be-ex-girlfriend by the shoulders so that she would no longer be blocking his car door and he could leave.

^-.-^

[Mytical]

For the most part I am a turn the other cheek type person anyhow. People for some reason end up getting hurt when I don't, and I'd rather not harm anybody if I can avoid it. I agree that if somebody is trying to hit somebody else (or succeeding) then if the person being hits retaliates..gender has no bearing on the situation.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I completely and wholeheartedly disagree with this statement. If a woman hits a man, she has given up all rights to any gender-based treatment. I don't believe any man, when confronted with an attack, has a duty to restrain the woman over defending themselves. Should we push this example further and say that men are not allowed to hit men who are smaller and weaker than they are? Or that women should not be allowed to retaliate against smaller women? It's kind of silly.

If someone is demonstrating a lack of respect for humanity by attacking another person, they should be treated equally, no matter what they've got between their legs.

What, so you'd agree with say, a child hitting an adult and then getting beaten shitless? Or a teenage boy hitting an adult then getting his face pounded in? Or a dotty old lady whacking a bloke with her walking stick thusly entitles that bloke to put her in hospital?

You're entitled to your opinion, but mine is that the weaker person, no matter what gender or age they are, should not be pulped by the stronger. The stronger person should have the decency to restrain them rather than beat the shit out of them.

[the_std]

What, so you'd agree with say, a child hitting an adult and then getting beaten shitless? Or a teenage boy hitting an adult then getting his face pounded in? Or a dotty old lady whacking a bloke with her walking stick thusly entitles that bloke to put her in hospital?

I was not talking about letting people beat each other until they're bloody and brain-damaged. You simply said that, if a woman hit a man, he should not hit her back at all, but attempt to restrain her. That is the piece I disagree with. A man should be allowed to defend himself past restraining his attacker. I never agree with beating someone until they're a pool of pulp on the floor - it goes way beyond self defense and into aggressive attack, but if the teenager or granny hit someone else hard enough to cause the attackee to feel like they have to protect themselves, then they should have thought of that before hitting someone. They're not immune to the consequences of their actions just because they're old or young.

The child is obviously a different story - we have whole laws based around treating children differently simply because they don't yet know better. So that example is moot to begin with.

[Amanita]

^I agree with this. If anyone wants to buck up and hit me, I should be allowed to use reasonable force to defend myself. If granny wants to take a swing at me with her cane, she may be old, but a piece of wood or metal is still capable of doing signifigant damage! Now, unless she is seriously trying to kill me, I'm not gonna curbstomp granny. But I will use enough force to make the assault stop. Likewise if a teenager tries to hit me. Do what it takes to make the attacker stop, whatever that may be. Once the point of making it stop is reached, then stop. But until that point is reached, do what it takes to protect yourself.

[blas87]

The problem is, if an underaged teen/kid is trying to mug/attack you, even fighting back can be considered child abuse unless you get some decent cops or pony up some cash for a really good lawyer.

[Amanita]

^And that's something that needs to be changed. A teen/kid who commits outright mugging/assault like that should lose the protection they gain from child abuse laws. They instigate the incident, they lose the protection.

Of course, something like this would have to be carefully drafted to discourage parents from using it as justification to beat the hell out of their children at the slightest provocation.

[Andara Bledin]

Teens already lose their minor status in the commission of violent crimes, dependent upon the crime and jurisdiction, of course.

^-.-^

[Evandril]

I can definitely understand why you'd want to be careful hitting a woman...My martial arts teacher is female, and I know I'd never want to hit her! Oh, wait, she's weaker or not as able to defend herself? Ummm, ok...You tell her that, I'll be hiding behind something *solid*, and filming it for laughs..

That being said, on the original topic, I open doors for almost everyone, though I do a 'better' job of it for women, I'll admit. The ones that complain, I tell them to open the door for me next time, or for someone else, and there is no 'debt', and since I am freely offering them the chance to do the same for me, it's obviously not because I find them weak or the like.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I was not talking about letting people beat each other until they're bloody and brain-damaged. You simply said that, if a woman hit a man, he should not hit her back at all, but attempt to restrain her. That is the piece I disagree with.

You disagreed with a point I never meant. I don't mean that the hypothetical ma should have to stand there while a woman whacks him with everything she has. Reasonable force, ie making her not a threat, I can agree with. However, him clobbering her til she's lying on the floor bleeding I can not. If you agree with the first part of what I said, then there's not a problem. I obviously didn't set it out properly. But don't put words in my mouth when I've said a dozen times that I have difficulty putting down what I mean.

[Evandril]

You disagreed with a point I never meant. I don't mean that the hypothetical man should have to stand there while a woman whacks him with everything she has. Reasonable force, ie making her not a threat, I can agree with. However, him clobbering her til she's lying on the floor bleeding I can not. If you agree with the first part of what I said, then there's not a problem. I obviously didn't set it out properly. But don't put words in my mouth when I've said a dozen times that I have difficulty putting down what I mean.

I had understood your words the same as he did, I do not believe it was a deliberate case of putting words in your mouth...rather a simple misunderstanding.

If a person comes at me with intent to hurt me, my reaction will be based on how capable they appear to be, not what gender/age/ect they are. There are big strong guys who I'd be able to restrain without much injury to either of us, and there are women/kids that nothing I did to defend myself would matter in the least...Hence my *first* choice being get the hell out of the area/situation, if possible.