Don't Be A Hero

[blas87]

I'm really not the type of person who takes everything as it is or is overly apathetic or replies to everything with "It is what it is"........you all are probably well aware of how outspoken and downright high strung I can be about things that I don't think are fair or right, and I have no qualms of voicing my opinion if I know that I won't compromise my job or other valueable essentials of life to do it.

But the thing is, sometimes you shouldn't be a hero or stand up for what you believe in. If it's the difference between keeping a roof over your head or being able to smoke every few hours on your break, just shut the fuck up and deal with it. Don't quit your job and praise yourself and pat yourself on the back because you stood up for what's "right" and you put it to your employer on what you really think. Because you just lost your job. In a still-shitty economy, where full time jobs with benefits and the opportunity for overtime are still almost non-existent or don't come without sacrifice, like being a temp for several months (hence, losing your benefits and having to go for a long period of time without any insurance) or just a seasonal or on-call person.

Don't get me wrong, I am by no means excusing some of the things companies have done during the recession and bad economy because they know employees will just take it because they don't want to be jobless (and I still stand by what I've said that as soon as things get better, many companies are going to experience mass exoduses of disgruntled employees), but something as simple as not being able to smoke at work......are you kidding me? That's worth losing your job over?

Some people never fail to amaze me. Better yet, they amaze me even more while they praise themselves for giving their employer the what-for, or the people who still work there who have already tried to break that policy and have been written up, then fired back with words that don't mean what they think it means. If I hear once more about how it's "discrimination" or "unconstitutional", I am going to effing scream.

Private property means they can say you can't smoke there. Same as a school or a hospital, where you can't smoke anywhere on the premises. It's totally legal. Smokers are not a protected class of people, it's not discrimination. If management wanted to demand that everyone quit smoking altogether, including off the clock, that would be another story. And nowhere in the Constitution does it say that every man has the right to smoke wherever and whenever he pleases. It does not impede on your right in the persuit of happiness. It will impede more on your persuit of happiness by not having a damn job.

Sorry that I keep dwelling on this. It just fucking bugs me.

[DrFaroohk]

lol...that stuff all reminds me of the people who throw around "class action lawsuit."

"Hey you better accept my out of date coupon or I'll file a class action lawsuit against you!"

[Hyena Dandy]

I mean, that's not being a hero as far as I'm concerned. A hero stands up for what they believe in. But I think you have a pretty skewed world view if what you truly believe in is being able to smoke. That's not a right. That's a privilege.

Some things no right-minded person would put up with. Some things are worth losing your job over. But I REALLY don't think that's one of them.

There's a difference between standing up for your principles and just being a whiny prick.

[telecom_goddess]

You're right about it being private property and they can allow smoking or not allow smoking as they please. What I don't agree with is the policy you say they have of not allowing people to leave said property to smoke elsewhere, even on lunch, which is unpaid time...FUCK THAT. I'm afraid I'd be leaving at least on my lunch if I needed to....that's bullshit.

[Mytical]

While I do believe that not everything is important enough to be a hero for..I will quote something. "You've got to stand for something, or you'll fall for anything."

Just because something is a rule or law, does not automatically mean it is RIGHT. Sometimes you have to stand up, fight for what you believe in, and understand the consequences for doing so. Is smoking one of those things? For me personally? No. Because I don't smoke. I also really don't want to smell others second hand smoke. That is just me.

[DrFaroohk]

Plus you gotta watch for the slippery slope thing. It might not be a big deal right now for a company to say you can't smoke, but you let the get away with that, and next thing you know they're installing chips in your wallet to read your mind and spy on you.

[blas87]

Our lunch breaks are paid. Every break we have is paid for, as I have said before. We are not allowed to punch out, if you do, you cannot go back in for 8 hours (the amount of off-time you need between shifts). Anyone who wanted to punch out and smoke anyway wouldn't be allowed back into the system and would have to tell their supervisor why they punched out, as if they wouldn't smell of smoke and it would reveal itself anyway. Hourly people cannot punch out at any time unless it's to go home for the day, every. break. is. paid. for. That's why they can do it.

Once again, I am NOT saying everyone needs to take everything companies throw at them in the name of saving money or budget cutting and lay down and not stand up. However, if you risk being homeless by doing it, then why? Why do that? All over a policy that you don't like?

[aurelemsrealm]

I don't regard putting your welfare in jeopardy on principle to be necessarily heroic. As my mother would put it, "It's cutting off your nose to spite your face." Those who make a snap decision to quit just because they are no longer allowed to smoke on breaks are just shooting themselves in the foot.

On the one hand, I agree with those who think the company policy is ridiculous, personally. Having said that, I also understand that the company can dictate what is or is not allowed on its property. Like, if there is a problem with littering from cigarette butts or something of that nature, I can understand wanting to eliminate that problem. I get terribly annoyed when I see people throw cigarette butts on the ground rather than in an ashtray or trash can, especially if I'm going to be expected to sweep it up later. On the other hand, the company should expect some sort of backlash or resentment when they go imposing unreasonable restrictions on employees. Employees have to work to make ends meet. Why make employees miserable at work?

I no longer actually smoke as I've switched over to snus and dissolvable tobacco products to get my fix since those product are becoming more widely available. My wife hates the smoking habit, so I switched to something less offensive to her as a compromise. I could never stomach the chew and spit routine, so it was tricky before snus and dissolvable tobacco became more common. That wouldn't matter to me so much in reality. If I were to smoke, though, I'd probably just try to sneak around with it rather than loudly state my opinion. If caught, I'd be honest enough to accept the consequences. If not caught, what they don't know won't hurt them. It may not be the smartest decision I could make, but it is probably what I would do.

[Ginger Tea]

As I said in your other thread, someone working on behalf of the work force (smokers and non) could have hashed out a compromise in the six months between the announcement of the ban and the enforcement thereof.

eg: repealing of the clocking off rueling at lunch, even if that does generate resentment towards non smokers getting paid lunch. The flipside would be no one gets paid lunch, so you loose out on an hours wage a day due to someone elses smoking habbit.
but still atleast it would have been some form of compromise.

[blas87]

There was no arguing or compromising. The company saved a lot of money on their insurance by forcing the workplace to be smoke free. End of story. No arguing, no bargaining, no compromise. Tough shit, but that's how it is.

[telecom_goddess]

I didn't realize the lunches were paid as well sorry......then ya I guess you're stuck. But damn I'm really glad I don't work at a place that tells me I can't leave the presmises ever during the work day.....I don't like that at all.

As for the SNUS and stuff I've tried them in the past and don't care for them.....I"m still using the electronic cigs though.

[blas87]

It's no biggie. Most places don't pay for all the breaks, especially lunch. But alas, there is the ammo right there for not allowing people to leave the premesis.

Well, I should reword that. You can go outside to move your car, or if you desperately want to take break alone and warm up your car, by all means, go ahead. But don't even try smoking.

Security is now actually making use of all of their cameras, and I have heard they are spot spying individuals who go outside to make sure they don't try anything. Obviously during a shift change or several people going outside, that doesn't work as well, but during breaks when only a few people venture out to move their cars closer to the building, they will watch you to make sure you don't light up. These cameras can see exactly what you are doing, even if you are in your car.

So ironic that before the smoking ban, security couldn't catch the guy who broke into my friend's car at 3 am or a former coworker's crazy ex bf who would come by every night at the same time and let the air out of her tires. She ended up calling the cops and having one waiting nearby to catch him, because security was hopeless.

On another note, our goal was significantly lowered for this term. I have no doubt that at least some of it, if not most, has to do with the smoking ban. Many over-acheivers who would max out on overtime every week are probably not going to do any more than what is required anymore, unless they really want the cash. I doubt anyone is going to slack enough to get in trouble, but the morale itself is going to be so low for at least a month or so, that production is not going to be an even upward flow.

[DrFaroohk]

I take it they ban smoking for two reasons - 1st, to remove yet another reason people might have to take an extra break and 2 - cigarette butts all over the ground.

What I don't get about stuff like this is why don't they just punish the ones who abuse it? God forbid someone have to do some WORK and actually monitor the situation, but in the end you'd have the best of both worlds. The people who treat the privilege with respect will still be able to do so, and those who abuse it will lose it. The smokers are happy because they can smoke and the non-smokers have run out of things to bitch, moan and cry about because people aren't taking too many breaks and littering all over the place.

[blas87]

One of my informants told me that the company saved millions of dollars on their insurance by making the place smoke-free. I can only assume that as time goes on, all work places will eventually go smoke free or have to pay out the wazoo for insurance policies for their workers.

It also doesn't help that the company's HQ is in a very big progressive anti-smoking state, so they mimick whatever that plant does.

[PepperElf]

though you know there's also another downside to telling your boss 'what for' when you quit. references for your next job.

now granted part of me does question the legality of it, but... i'm pretty sure no one really wants to pay for a lawyer to question it either. not if the end result is having to find a new job.

then again from what i've read of your other stories about them, they pretty much treat you like children anyway ... so it's not surprising they'd micromanage that too.