If You Love Me ...

[tabbyblack13]

I think the main issue is that we don't know the whole story.

If I had someone in my life that made unreasonable demands I would kick them to the curb. I can understand spending time together but unless there is an really good reason to give up my hobbies (gaming included). I will also admit that if anyone said "It the cats or me" that person would be out the door as fast as possible.

I can understand getting married and having kids but to treat someone you are suppose to love like that is a bit on the mean side. He should be able to have his own friends and hobbies without interference from her. I have also been to Cons and have seen quite a large number of children there. There are many Cons now that are becoming family orientated. Maybe she should be a bit more open to what her husband likes.

[LewisLegion]

I've never understood this...permission thing that seems prevalent in most marriages. Where does this come from?? What do you mean, they don't allow, you only have permission.. I'm sorry, but these are grown-ups in a partnership, aren't they? If I was married I would never dream of granting permission for my husband to do anything he desires. Yes, some things are understood (cheating will get you divorced, emptying the bank account to buy a ferrari we can't afford will probably get you divorced, being a drug addict/drunk/abusive spouse etc will get you arrested and divorced, etc.)

But as far as saying what movies or games he can enjoy or which ones he can't...who he can have as a friend and who he can't...what he can buy at the store and what he can't...who am I to tell another grown person what they can or cannot do?? Serious issues can come up as a discussion and a compromise made for the sake of the partnership, but flat out saying 'sorry, you can't go to any more conventions simply because I think they're stupid' is absolutely ridiculous! Do you want a husband or a child/slave?

[blas87]

I've never understood the permission or "can't" thing, either.

Don't get me wrong, most of my bf's friends I cannot stand (I have valid reasons, they are criminals or just absolute retards) and I would rather he didn't go home to go hang with them or I'd prefer if he stayed home with me instead of going out to party like his idiot single friends, but it's not like I'm going to get in the car and chase him and then hide around the bars spying on him or go as far as some girls and hunt their man down and make a scene over it.

That's psycho. Granted, I take a very non-constructive plan for those things and usually just stay home and get really mad at him and stay mad at him, but it's so much better and saves time, money, and my pride and mental health if I don't sink to the level of a crazy woman. I have never been tempted to, mostly because the cost of gas is more important to me (isn't that funny I'm so worried about what everything costs), but also because growing up with a mother who loved to cause scenes (she was raised in a family that thrived on drama and causing huge scenes, especially in public), I try to avoid any kind of raucus in public, under any and all circumstances.

Oh, terribly sorry, I'm rambling.

I'm really not playing Devil's Advocate or anything, I'm just saying there are things I cannot stand and people I cannot stand that my bf hangs with, but I never tell him anything about what he can or can't do. I don't make rules. He'd laugh in my face, same as if he ever tried to tell me what I could or couldn't do.

[Boozy]

I've never understood this...permission thing that seems prevalent in most marriages.

I haven't found this "permission thing" to be prevalent in the marriages of people *I* know.

What I have found in successful marriages is a negotiation of expectations.

I can no longer do whatever I want, whenever I want. I have a family now. That family is just me and my husband, but we depend on each other. If I spend money on something, it comes out of our family budget. If I spend time on something, it comes out of our "time" budget - the time we spend together.

Now, that's not to say we run every single decision past one another. He can do whatever the hell he wants for his lunch break - I'm at work anyway, and the $25 he spends going out (if that's what he decides) isn't going to break the bank for us.

But if he's not going to be home for dinner, he has to tell me. I might have something planned to cook. And if he wants to go out for dinner with co-workers for the third night in a row, I might say "no". He's not asking for "permission" when he calls. He's essentially asking me "How do you feel about this? Do you need your husband tonight? Are you okay with some extra time apart this week, or do you feel that we need to re-connect at this point?"

We don't usually run purchases past one another, either, unless it's over about $500. Different couples will have different thresholds, depending on their finances.

It's just a courtesy given to someone you love and who depends on you.

If I was married I would never dream of granting permission for my husband to do anything he desires. Yes, some things are understood (cheating will get you divorced...)

I found this interesting, because it's a good example of the different results of the negotiations that occur between couples.

Based on this statement, I'm assuming that cheating is a "deal-breaker" for you. But for many couples, it isn't.

Personally, if my husband cheated, I can't say what I would do. It would definitely not be an automatic divorce. It would depend on the circumstances, how contrite he is, and how committed he is to repairing the relationship.

We've been together for 10 years, we've built a life together -- and I'm a realist. These things can happen.

You know what would be an automatic deal-breaker for me? If he consistently blew all his vacation time on gaming conventions and refused to reconsider his use of leisure time to focus on our relationship.

So just because someone has a relationship that wouldn't make sense for you doesn't mean that either part is controlling the other. It could just be a different set of priorities are at play.

[Andara Bledin]

You know what would be an automatic deal-breaker for me? If he consistently blew all his vacation time on gaming conventions and refused to reconsider his use of leisure time to focus on our relationship.

If a person got engaged to someone who spent 7 of the 52 weekends out of a year attending gaming conventions and had done so for the entire time they knew them, then making that a "deal breaker" would be rather presumptuous, wouldn't it?

If a person needs a minimum of 51 weekends with their significant other, that's some seriously needy behavior. I'd be wanting to escape by the end of three months, tops.

^-.-^

[Peppergirl]

Isn't the solution in this situation simply balance?

It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing, does it?

I mean, If someone attended 10 gaming conventions a year before getting into a relationship with someone, I'd find it fair to ask them to perhaps only attend half. To me, it's about compromise. Couples need time together, but they also need time to focus on individual interests.

We don't know the couple in the example. From an outsiders perspective (mine, at least) she seems like a shrew and he sounds p-whipped. Do I know that to be fact? Absolutely not, but I can definitely see why Andara would view it that way.

I will admit that I am likely far from objective. I will concede that I am a VERY strange breed. I value my 'alone time' and time to pursue MY interests almost as much as I do 'couple' time. I will also concede that this likely isn't a healthy attitude, but it works for me.

Perhaps being married 15 years to a man I was miserable with has made me place my freedom in a higher priority than anything else. Perhaps I'm simply selfish.

Hmmmm, lots to think about...sorry for rambling.

Also, the points made about finances and huge work weeks are very valid as well. There's a whole host of info that we don't know, but if this woman is TRULY only 'allowing' him to attend one convention, and then further considers it some sort of *gift* or big fucking favor she's doing - sorry, but she's a controlling bitch. Granted - there could be extenuating circumstances, but with the little info given she simply sounds like a control freak. JMO.

[AdminAssistant]

I'm going to echo the others and say that Andara's probably right in this particular situation; she sounds a bit shrewish. However, speaking on the general topic:

I can no longer do whatever I want, whenever I want. I have a family now. That family is just me and my husband, but we depend on each other. If I spend money on something, it comes out of our family budget. If I spend time on something, it comes out of our "time" budget - the time we spend together.

I think Boozy really nailed it here. Fiance and I aren't married, but we are living together. He's my 'family' although not yet in the legal sense. When he wants to make a large purchase or a life decision, he asks me my opinion. He's in the process of applying to a video game design program. He's wanted to do it for years. Of course, I wasn't going to say, "No, you can't do that." But he (and therefore, we) will be taking on a lot of extra debt, not to mention the pressure of having both of us in school at the same time. I asked him a lot of questions about the program, the field, etc. I needed to know that he was confident about this particular school and his chances for employment after.

Right now, we're in the "infatuation/honeymoon" stage of things, so even one weekend apart feels like an eternity. I went home for a week without him, and it was hard for both of us. But he knew that I needed to spend some time with my family. I left after such a short time because my parents realize that I needed to be with him. Compromise.

[Mytical]

Compromise is indeed the name of the game. People need their space sometimes, and sometimes they do not want to be apart. Balance is important.

Some people are all give and no take, however. They expect their partners to give up everything, and they themselves give up nothing. I've known a few of those. If that is your thing, more power too you..each their own I say. Personally, I don't mind 'giving up' certain things for a special other..but I wouldn't want a one way street either.

[Andara Bledin]

It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing, does it?

It shouldn't, but I know of several cases in my sphere where one member of a couple made some decree that the other member was to follow or the relationship would be over.

I used my former gamer friend as an example because it was an easy segue from the quote that made me think of it.

As another example:

My brother has a friend that got married. The woman chose the guest list. If she didn't like someone, no matter how close he was to them, they weren't coming. And nobody who wasn't allowed at the wedding was allowed to attend the reception. All decisions were made by her.

Unlike the first example, this marriage self-destructed in less than a year.

Absolutely not, but I can definitely see why Andara would view it that way.

Hey, if he says he's pussy whipped, I tend to agree.

^-.-^

[Ginger Tea]

As another example:

My brother has a friend that got married. The woman chose the guest list. If she didn't like someone, no matter how close he was to them, they weren't coming. And nobody who wasn't allowed at the wedding was allowed to attend the reception. All decisions were made by her.

Unlike the first example, this marriage self-destructed in less than a year.

Makes me wonder why some people get married at all.
Granted 2 people paying rent is better than 2 lots of rent, so moving in together makes financial sense.
But if your doing it purely for financial reasons like you can not afford to live alone, get a room mate, get a lodger, hell if they could pay rent get a cat, get lots of cats.

Just don't fuck up someone elses life just so you don't grow old alone.

My thing used to be music festivals, I still go, but I only do 2 or sometimes 3 local events, I couldn't afford to do too many at one point as I was saving up to move, but I proabably could have done 3 big events* or more if too many didn't clash and I could get the time off obviously as most are summer based and only worked in the student's favour as that was a gurantied break.

If I were in a situation where I was given the ulitimatum to pick one and one only, I would question her motives as I would be the one working for the money and my fair share of the rent and bills being paid, whats left is mine and it would only be a few long weekends apart and belive me, I'm not someone you can put up with for too long, that or I end up needing me time way before you do.
So if anything, it would be a well needed break from each other, couples are not joined at the hip and if they were they would probably kill each other trying to perform surgery.

*Now its just getting the ticket as alot used to sell out within hours

[AdminAssistant]

My brother has a friend that got married. The woman chose the guest list. If she didn't like someone, no matter how close he was to them, they weren't coming. And nobody who wasn't allowed at the wedding was allowed to attend the reception. All decisions were made by her.

My Fiance and I are going to have to deal with this when we deal with guest lists. We may be paring down to just family and very very close friends, which will make it a non-issue (I hope), but still....

There was a girl in college who, to me, was a mean, selfish bitch. We were in the same department, and she told me, to my face, that I was "too damn fat to act." IMO, she's an attention-grabbing little slut (she slept with most of my male friends) and I had a good laugh when she dropped out her senior year. However, for whatever reason, her and Fiance were good friends (and no, she did not sleep with him.) When we were talking about doing a bigger wedding, he wanted to invite her. I said no. I'm sorry, but she made my life *hell*. She's a bully. Besides, frankly, it's my day, and I know she'd do something to make it all about her because that's what she does. I'd be too afraid that she would deliberately do something to sabotage the whole thing.

And frankly, they haven't spoken in several years. So, I don't think I'm being unreasonable.

As far as the second part, I find it *extremely* rude to have separate guest lists for the wedding and the reception. To me, it says "you aren't important enough to witness the actual ceremony, but please come to the part where you bring us presents." There isn't any good reason I can think of to have a small ceremony and a large reception, with the exception of a destination wedding.

As far as the decisions being made by her, most wedding decisions are made by the bride because the groom isn't interested. Luckily, Fiance does take an interest, but most guys just want to know what to wear, when to be there, and where to stand.

[Ginger Tea]

As far as the second part, I find it *extremely* rude to have separate guest lists for the wedding and the reception. To me, it says "you aren't important enough to witness the actual ceremony, but please come to the part where you bring us presents." There isn't any good reason I can think of to have a small ceremony and a large reception, with the exception of a destination wedding.

I've only been invited to wedding receptions, 2 so far, have to admit I don't know that many people who were or are getting married right this moment.
One was the best mate of my brother, he went to the wedding I and a few others just went for the beer afterwards, I hardly knew the guy that well then, the other was for one of my supervisors, co-workers at a wedding? erm thank you, no.
Co-workers getting pissed up safe in the knowledge none of us have to work the next day and are cut some slack if we tell someone higher up where to go (place I was at at the time was kinda slack on the clock what you said as long as you could recieve it just as well)

A few people at my current job got married, but I hardly knew them at the time, so it would be like having a church / registry office full of strangers, I'm not even sure if they had family come over from Poland or not.
One of our drivers got married at Gretna Green and wasn't expecting many people (friends and family) to turn out due to the distance, let alone co workers, I can't even recall if I knew about them getting married till they were back from honeymoon.

TL;DR
In short, 2 lists is fine, I wouldn't like having co-workers at my wedding (I don't see any of them outside of work at the best of tmes), but I would be happy to see em show up at the reception and if they didn't no biggie.

[Rageaholic]

Also, the points made about finances and huge work weeks are very valid as well. There's a whole host of info that we don't know, but if this woman is TRULY only 'allowing' him to attend one convention, and then further considers it some sort of *gift* or big fucking favor she's doing - sorry, but she's a controlling bitch. Granted - there could be extenuating circumstances, but with the little info given she simply sounds like a control freak. JMO.

That's how I see it. This sounds very familular to a few people I know where the wife is in charge and decides everything. If she lets you decide something, she acts like it's a huge gift. I know, different strokes for different folks, but I question if there's really love in such a controlling relationship.

[Boozy]

If a person got engaged to someone who spent 7 of the 52 weekends out of a year attending gaming conventions and had done so for the entire time they knew them, then making that a "deal breaker" would be rather presumptuous, wouldn't it?

Before I go on, I need to make it clear that I'm addressing the issue in general only. I will defer to your judgment when it comes to your friend and his relationship, since you know him best.

But, in general, I don't see a problem with asking a significant other to cease and desist certain activities after committing to a relationship, no matter how long that person has been doing said activity.

For example, I used to sleep with other men before committing to a relationship with my husband. It's not terribly unreasonable for him to ask me to stop that, is it?

[Andara Bledin]

For example, I used to sleep with other men before committing to a relationship with my husband. It's not terribly unreasonable for him to ask me to stop that, is it?

See, the vast majority of, well, everybody would agree that those are completely different realms.

A family pastime that both partners could enjoy and eventually take their kids to is quite removed from sleeping with individuals other than the one that you presumably have pledged to be faithful to.

^-.-^