The "inferiority" of America

[Rageaholic]

First let me say that I realize that America isn't perfect. We have our problems just like any other country. I'm not gonna act like we're the end all or be all and I can laugh at some jokes poking fun at America (especially our government ).

However, I get sick and tired of the constant hatred that some people have toward this country and more importantly, the people in this country. If I had a dollar for everytime I heard some jackass say that americans are "fat lazy and stupid", I'd be a wealthy man. All over the internet, there's these stereotypes people have about your typical American. With some even saying they'd be happy if some natural disaster wiped us out. I know it's just comments on the internet, but it bugs me.

What really gets me is the double standard I often see (usually in some of my college courses). It's okay to talk shit about how flawed America is, but if we dare criticize another culture, we're being bigoted or ethnocentric. Even if we have a perfectly valid reason for the criticism (like the treatment of women in some middle eastern countries), we're just not understanding the culture.

I beg to differ, but okay. But what about some of these jackasses who talk about how stupid us Americans are and how much smarter they are? Hell, even some Americans have this idea that we are inferior and that the grass is much greener on the other side (usually China). Now correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't China house those sweat shops we hear horror stories about? Don't they also have a government that censors fiction they don't agree with?. And they may have a higher standard, but don't they also have a higher suicide rate?

Not trying to say we're better, but the grass isn't always greener.

[Plaidman]

There is no such thing as a perfect country. Every country has faults, and horrible people.


The only thing that talks in this world is money, though thankfully lots of people can't be bought.


I don't belive in America. Too much corruption, and lack of caring for anyone that isn't loaded with cash or hot. A country that relies on the physically talented rather then the mind or personality.

But so is every other country in the world.

That being said, I don't belive that America is inferior. It's about equal to most countries. At least in America, you can practice whatever religion you want, (unless it's anything other then christinality, then ya better be quiet, especally if your muslim). In America, you can do whatever you want, (As long as your rich and/or connected).

....

Sorry. Honestly, the only good thing about America, compared to other countries, is women rights and the image of tolerence for other races and faiths, even if it's false in many areas.


In other countries? Pretty much the same. With the exception of sex slaves in some countries, and lack of women rights. They generally have more unity (Divided between faiths, but they make up with it in sheer teneciousness).

[smileyeagle1021]

What a perfect country is depends greatly on the person. There are many people for whom America is the best country on the planet, for others Canada would be the best, and for others France, etc. For most people they are happy with where they live, but for others, they just never feel right.
Personally, I'm not proud to be an American. I hate living in a country that claims that all men are equal yet it is legal to discriminate against homosexuals in housing and employment in over half the states, large numbers of people say they will never vote for a candidate who is Mormon or Muslim, and we consider it more amazing that a black man got elected than a college drop out.

[the_std]

This entire topic is a bit of a foreign concept to me. I do not understand the personalizing of an entire country and taking it as personally as it seems many Americans do. Why be angry when someone says, "America sucks!"? They aren't talking about you, they're simply talking about the country you live in. A country with millions of people and thousands of laws and a hell of a lot of land, all of which makes you statistically puny and insignificant... So why take it personally?

I can see the validity in arguing specifics. If someone came up to me and said "The USA's tax laws are superior to Canada's", then fine, have yourselves a good ol' argument. But if someone came up to me and said, "Canada sucks and you all suck for living in Canada" (which has happened, most notably when I was in France) I just shrug and go on my way. Know why? Because the country I live in is not any kind of significant locus of my identity. I live here, and I like living here. I might go so far as to say I love living here. This country suits me well enough that it would be impractical to move anywhere else at this point. But that doesn't mean that I would be personally insulted if someone felt otherwise.

This feeling also applies to generalizations and stereotypes. I've heard all of them. Canadians are too polite to get any real work done, we all live in igloos and are lumberjacks (aren't the two mutually exclusive?), and we all have to fear mauling by polar bears on a regular basis. Yeah, people are ignorant and may lump us all together when they feel the need to express that particular ignorance. But unless they are passing laws or acting on my life in such a way that negatively affects me on a regular basis, then what do I care if they think I live a life of frost and plaid? Their ignorance just makes it easier to prove them wrong and surpass their expectations. Once again, their stereotypes about the piece of land I happen to live on have no direct bearing on my everyday life, so why give a shit?

Edited to add: I understand the frustration of the double standard, it sucks when people are blind to their own faults but blame everyone else for the same things they do. People can suck sometimes. But again... If they're being WILLFULLY ignorant (and I would qualifying "all Americans as fat and lazy and stupid" willfully ignorant, as it is so damn easy to find evidence to the contrary), then why the hell do you care what they think? They're intentional idiots. You're not going to change their minds, so pointing out their own flaws probably won't help at all.

[draco664]

Honestly, the only good thing about America, compared to other countries, is women rights and the image of tolerence for other races and faiths, even if it's false in many areas.

I beg to differ. The best thing about America is your constitution and bill of rights.

The authors of those documents nailed it. Those pieces of paper place restrictions on the government, not on the people (with the notable exception of making slave trading illegal).

Despite all the 'human rights' fads and obligations going around recently (have you read the un declaration of human rights? Countries would bankrupt themselves attempting to adhere to all its articles), it's the US's that will stand the test of time.

[Plaidman]

I beg to differ. The best thing about America is your constitution and bill of rights.

The authors of those documents nailed it. Those pieces of paper place restrictions on the government, not on the people (with the notable exception of making slave trading illegal

Indeed. Bill of rights and consitution had no bearing on African Americas. I still don't get how slavery even got fucking started with those two in effect. Oh wait, the goverment will twist and change anything to suit it's need.

[Boozy]

Hell, even some Americans have this idea that we are inferior and that the grass is much greener on the other side (usually China).

I suspect you've been misinterpreting the comparisons being made between the US and China. The only comparisons that favour China are ones involving economic growth rates and liquidity.

No remotely educated person is going to claim that China is a better place to live than the US. Everything's worse in China - civil rights, the environment, GDP per capita, education, literacy rates.... I could go on and on.

[Rageaholic]

This entire topic is a bit of a foreign concept to me. I do not understand the personalizing of an entire country and taking it as personally as it seems many Americans do. Why be angry when someone says, "America sucks!"? They aren't talking about you, they're simply talking about the country you live in. A country with millions of people and thousands of laws and a hell of a lot of land, all of which makes you statistically puny and insignificant... So why take it personally?

I don't really care if anyone bashes the country so much. Hell, there are things I hate about this country so it's not like I'm totally biased. It's when they bash and stereotype the people it gets on my nerves. Claiming that everyone here is fat, lazy, and stupid is just ignorant. Take into account the double standard (it's okay to bash Americans, but not anyone else), then it gets annoying.

[the_std]

It's when they bash and stereotype the people it gets on my nerves. Claiming that everyone here is fat, lazy, and stupid is just ignorant. Take into account the double standard (it's okay to bash Americans, but not anyone else), then it gets annoying.

This feeling also applies to generalizations and stereotypes. I've heard all of them. Canadians are too polite to get any real work done, we all live in igloos and are lumberjacks (aren't the two mutually exclusive?), and we all have to fear mauling by polar bears on a regular basis. Yeah, people are ignorant and may lump us all together when they feel the need to express that particular ignorance. But unless they are passing laws or acting on my life in such a way that negatively affects me on a regular basis, then what do I care if they think I live a life of frost and plaid? Their ignorance just makes it easier to prove them wrong and surpass their expectations. Once again, their stereotypes about the piece of land I happen to live on have no direct bearing on my everyday life, so why give a shit?

Edited to add: I understand the frustration of the double standard, it sucks when people are blind to their own faults but blame everyone else for the same things they do. People can suck sometimes. But again... If they're being WILLFULLY ignorant (and I would qualifying "all Americans as fat and lazy and stupid" willfully ignorant, as it is so damn easy to find evidence to the contrary), then why the hell do you care what they think? They're intentional idiots. You're not going to change their minds, so pointing out their own flaws probably won't help at all.

I believe I already covered the answer to your response in my first post. Ignorance can be frustrating, but really... Why waste your energy caring?

[Greenday]

Personally, I'm not proud to be an American. I hate living in a country that claims that all men are equal yet it is legal to discriminate against homosexuals in housing and employment in over half the states, large numbers of people say they will never vote for a candidate who is Mormon or Muslim, and we consider it more amazing that a black man got elected than a college drop out.

Would you prefer to live in a country where it's legal to kill someone for being gay and it's celebrated? There might be parts of the US, say...Utah, where it's pretty much legal to discriminate against people for being gay, but then you also have places like NJ where the justice system will destroy you for committing a crime against someone because they were gay.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Actually, one of the really great things about America is that nobody will try to prevent anyone from leaving. Which very few people actually do (even though they rail about how horrible it is over here.)

People sure do pour over our borders to get in, though, don't they?

What sucks is human nature. And the US is made of humans, so unfortunately, it's full of hypocrisy and corruption, too. Just like every other country. Our country has one over on many other countries because we do have the possibility to change things. We have a Bill of Rights, which at least gives us a place to start when we've been wronged.

As a woman, I can think of a whole long list of places I can't even consider living my life in. There are countries where women cannot show their faces. There are countries where they publicly and horribly murder twelve year old rape victims for being unchaste. There are countries where girls are shot and strangled for dating the wrong boy or forced into marriage with older men before they're ten years old and raped.

Hell, there are countries where I might not even exist because I would have been considered so worthless I would have been aborted by my mother as soon as a lack of a penis became evident.

So as a woman I think I'll stay here and take my chances. But there's lots of flights to all over the world for anyone who thinks they can find a better deal somewhere else.

[mikoyan29]

America could be a great place if it could live up to the ideals set forth in the Declaration of Independence, Contstitution and Bill of Rights (although those two aren't separate). then you add in some of the other great documents of the country and you have something. However, often it can't live up to those ideals.

[Ipecac Drano]

For those who hate being lumped in with "the others", do you actually expect other countries and cultures to use a scalpel and excise you? Would it make any of you feel better if they said, "For the most part, Americans are lazy and stupid because they fall behind most industrial nations in educational standards. However, there are some Americans who can keep up with the rest of us."?

Granted, it's not a life or death matter to know where Louisiana is on the map, but it's such a simple thing to know!

[Rageaholic]

I suspect you've been misinterpreting the comparisons being made between the US and China. The only comparisons that favour China are ones involving economic growth rates and liquidity.

No remotely educated person is going to claim that China is a better place to live than the US. Everything's worse in China - civil rights, the environment, GDP per capita, education, literacy rates.... I could go on and on.

Yeah, I definately agree that China is not a place I'd want to live so I have some bias there.

A lot of what I heard about China makes it sound like a miserable and unhappy place. That's one of the reasons I get sick of this "well china is smarter". Perhaps, at what expense?

I believe I already covered the answer to your response in my first post. Ignorance can be frustrating, but really... Why waste your energy caring?

No reason, it just bugs me. Though I think I have legit reason to despise college courses trying to tell me that China is superior to America.

What sucks is human nature. And the US is made of humans, so unfortunately, it's full of hypocrisy and corruption, too. Just like every other country. Our country has one over on many other countries because we do have the possibility to change things. We have a Bill of Rights, which at least gives us a place to start when we've been wronged.

As a woman, I can think of a whole long list of places I can't even consider living my life in. There are countries where women cannot show their faces. There are countries where they publicly and horribly murder twelve year old rape victims for being unchaste. There are countries where girls are shot and strangled for dating the wrong boy or forced into marriage with older men before they're ten years old and raped.

Yes yes and yes. This is why I cannot stand this all this politically correct glurge about how we have to understand other cultures no matter how fucked up they are. No, when they kill their children for dating the wrong person, that's not 'culture' that's fucked up. I'm fine understanding other cultures, but not when they advocate murder. Human rights should always come before cultural rights.

For those who hate being lumped in with "the others", do you actually expect other countries and cultures to use a scalpel and excise you? Would it make any of you feel better if they said, "For the most part, Americans are lazy and stupid because they fall behind most industrial nations in educational standards. However, there are some Americans who can keep up with the rest of us."?

Granted, it's not a life or death matter to know where Louisiana is on the map, but it's such a simple thing to know!

"Americans are fat, lazy, and stupid".

"America is behind other nations in industrial standards."

I hate to pull the politcally correct card, but there are ways to say that without sounding like an arrogant douche.

Even then, it still bothers me because this is usually used when comparing US to China. What I get from this is that they're saying we should be like China, a country where human rights are spat on and suicide rates are high thanks to high standards. What I'm really sick of (and was shying away in my OP) is all this praise toward China when it's such a miserable place. I take my freedom and self worth over high achievements any day.

[Ipecac Drano]

I hate to pull the politcally correct card, but there are ways to say that without sounding like an arrogant douche.

"Americans are fat, lazy, and stupid".

So, how would you want them to say this? What would be the politically correct way of saying that?

"America is behind other nations in industrial standards."

What does that even mean? America is the most industrialized nation on Earth, and, as far as I know, the rest of the world acknowledges that.

Even then, it still bothers me because this is usually used when comparing US to China. What I get from this is that they're saying we should be like China, a country where human rights are spat on and suicide rates are high thanks to high standards. What I'm really sick of (and was shying away in my OP) is all this praise toward China when it's such a miserable place. I take my freedom and self worth over high achievements any day.

So, you think that if America were to be smarter, it would be a country that spits on human rights and that its suicide rates would double? If you don't believe that, then keep human rights violations, suicides, and other social woes separate from education statistics. Those who praise China for their education did.

If you (and others) do believe that America would spiral downward into human rights violations, suicides and other social blights because of an increase in knowledge, then maybe the countries that look down on America might be making a fair assessment.