Bert and Ernie agenda

[Nyoibo]

actually that wasn't religion based but culture based.
nice try.

I'm pretty sure there as a few bible passages that could be used to justify that so you could make the same arguement about gay marriage, I think you'll find that a church could refuse to marry an interracial couple too.

[PepperElf]

of course.... there's always people out there who will twist something into meaning what they want it to mean.

and of course i forgot... not supporting something means you're trying your damnnest to stop it and there must be something wrong with you... or so that's what i seem to be getting from this... that i must be a bad person because i don't see things the way others do.

am i right? not supporting the agenda means i'm a hater right?



we need a "meh" face.

[AdminAssistant]

not supporting the agenda means i'm a hater right?

Actually....kinda. The issue of gay marriage and the repeal of DOMA needs all the support it can get right now.

There are churches that refuse to marry people because they've lived in sin. I know a Justice of the Peace who refused to marry someone because he knew one had committed adultery in the past, and that goes against his personal values. Churches won't be forced to marry gay couples. Won't happen. Although, personally, I hope that we all become enlightened enough that all churches will allow gay marriages, or that at least we as a populace will no longer tolerate hate speech from the pulpit. But the government can't and won't do anything about either.

Bert and Ernie aren't gay, and I do hope that Sesame Street adds some gay characters. But with PBS continually on the Republican chopping block it might be dangerous to do so.

[PepperElf]

Actually....kinda. The issue of gay marriage and the repeal of DOMA needs all the support it can get right now.

Actually... no.

But thank you for proving one of my points.

The point that there ARE people out there who will feel you are "attacking" them by not supporting the same things they want you to support.

[jackfaire]

actually that wasn't religion based but culture based.
nice try.

Hence why I put "religion" in quote marks. There were people that claimed that interracial marriages were an abomination to god and entire churches of these people.

Their deeply held religious belief was often that marrying people of another race especially those people was like laying with animals. I know that was cultural but religion is part of culture.

My point is the government never told them, "Okay you have to stop being racist or perform interracial marriages now even though you find them abhorrent"

That's my point. Government cannot and will not tell people what to believe. Even if you want to believe that the Spaghetti Monster only wants you to have a 18 year old male quarterback cut your lawn on every other Tuesday while you sing Glory Glory on your front porch well as long as no part of that involves something illegal sing on.

I think everyone should feel and vote how they feel is right. I will support the right of someone to vote against gay marriage as much as I will support the right of a person to vote for it.

However I will also expect the person that votes against gay marriage to acknowledge that they are "attacking" the rights of others since no one has ever given a legitimate reason how gay marriage will negatively impact heterosexual marriage.

[DrFaroohk]

I am crushed to find out the Bert and Ernie are adults. I was going to comment that they're only like 10 years old, which is what I always thought they were, but then I looked it up and they're "Clearly" adults. Damn. Why are they adults? they're not adults. The only adults should be the real people.

[Mikkel]

and of course i forgot... not supporting something means you're trying your damnnest to stop it and there must be something wrong with you... or so that's what i seem to be getting from this... that i must be a bad person because i don't see things the way others do.

am i right? not supporting the agenda means i'm a hater right?

I don't know, being against that people you don't know and probably never will meet can get married, seems a little intolerant at best. Why should you have any say about that?

If you by "not supporting gay marriage" mean that you aren't actively supporting it, but won't actively oppose it either, I don't think you are anything close to a hater.

If I didn't have same-sex friends who passionately wanted to be married and whose wedding I attended when it was legalized in Denmark, I would probably feel like that too.

[Andara Bledin]

The point that there ARE people out there who will feel you are "attacking" them by not supporting the same things they want you to support.

But your other one still remains invalid and unsupported. Separation of church and state means the state will keep out of churchly matters (up to a certain point - they won't allow things such as human sacrifice and polygamy no matter what a religion says) and only stick there nose in when it goes beyond a purely churchly situation.

If I didn't have same-sex friends who passionately wanted to be married and whose wedding I attended when it was legalized in Denmark, I would probably feel like that too.

I am specifically non-apathetic on any matter that is, at heart, a human rights issue.

The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men. - Plato

^-.-^

[Ginger Tea]

I am crushed to find out the Bert and Ernie are adults. I was going to comment that they're only like 10 years old, which is what I always thought they were, but then I looked it up and they're "Clearly" adults. Damn. Why are they adults? they're not adults. The only adults should be the real people.

Kermit spent some time on Sesamey street as a news reporter and there is a clearly adult humanoid muppet news anchor too, I thought Elmo was the only child muppet and he wasn't in it when I was a kid.
If Oscar the grouch was a child there would be no way they would let him live in a trash can

oh and I forgot to comment in my first post, Kermit and Miss Piggy would be inter species not inter racial, I don't think State let alone Church would allow that one to pass, no matter how much you love your donkey.

[Nyoibo]

The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men. - Plato
^-.-^

Also, The only thing necesary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

[PepperElf]

But your other one still remains invalid and unsupported. Separation of church and state means the state will keep out of churchly matters (up to a certain point - they won't allow things such as human sacrifice and polygamy no matter what a religion says) and only stick there nose in when it goes beyond a purely churchly situation.

Ah... i see. when it goes beyond "churchy". that's why no one tried petitioning to have churches removed from tax-free status because of non-support. no one would ever try punishing a church like that after all. nope. no chance whatsoever of coming down on a church with the government over something like this.

[Ladeeda]

Tax status has nothing to do with their beliefs, so long as a church remains non-profit.

Churches that actively donate to politicians or political movements should definitely lose their status.

And frankly, I've never seen a church that made enough to cover expenses use the extra for actual "godly" or charitable uses. And they are still tax exempt.

Pepper, you don't like gay marriage. Yes, you're a hater. It's not a matter of... whatever half-baked reasons you have for being against a civil right. The point is it IS a civil right people are being denied.

There is no logical, secular reason for anyone to be against gay marriage. Only religious based nonsense, and religion has no place in lawmaking. If it doesn't apply to atheists, it should not affect legal policy.

I have no use for the Bible except to steady a wobbly table. Why should your religious views apply to me?

[Mikkel]

In Denmark, as in many other countries, we have a civil right to be in a "registered partnership" which give all the legal rights as a traditional marriage. Inheritance and so on.

A few churches chose to bless the partnership, others will only bless heterosexual marriages. It's up to the church and for instance in the Danish Peoples Church , the "official" church, it's the individual priest's decision.

To get back to Bert and Ernie. I can't see it matters more than Harry/Draco 'shippers. The makers of the series has spoken.

[Andara Bledin]

In Denmark, as in many other countries, we have a civil right to be in a "registered partnership" which give all the legal rights as a traditional marriage. Inheritance and so on.

If it "has all the legal rights" then why not just call it a marriage and make it the same rather than make it separate, and thus, still able to be made not the same?

As long as same-gender couples are denied the right to have their "legal partnership" be a legal marriage in name and legal standing, there is still discrimination going on. Only in this case it becomes the quiet, insidious form of discrimination that so many refuse to believe even exists.

^-.-^

[Mikkel]

I agree it would be better to use the same word. It's probably a political compromise, when it isn't called marriage, the religious won't vote against.
Perhaps after the autumn elections we will have another government in power.

There is a bit of background on Wikipedia.