plea bargins

[BlaqueKatt]

especially in cases like this

The 28-year-old Bangor father was originally charged with felony child neglect resulting in death. Meyer entered an Alford plea to misdemeanor child neglect Monday in an agreement with prosecutors. Meyer does not admit guilt, but acknowledges there's enough evidence to convict him.

yup caused the death of his four-month old daughter due to neglect, and gets the horrendous punishment of a $1500.00 fine

[DrFaroohk]

My thing with plea bargains is this: What if the child had been kidnapped, but one of the kidnappers comes forward and says in exchange for a light sentence he'd tell you where the child was. That'd be fine right?

But once you start allowing it to happen, it gets harder and harder to decide where to draw the line. If its ok in a kidnapping, what about a murder? What about....

[Andara Bledin]

Honestly, I find no fault at all with this particular decision.

La Cross Tribune article with far more detail

yup caused the death of his four-month old daughter due to neglect, and gets the horrendous punishment of a $1500.00 fine

I would be very much surprised if any parent can honestly say they've not done something very similar at some point. Most of the time, nothing happens, and nobody even thinks about how foolish the act was.

Unfortunately, there are those times when something does happen, and then the bloodthirsty whip out the pitchforks to go after an overworked father who has to live with the memory of finding his daughter under that bean bag chair for the rest of his life because obviously that's not enough suffering for his heinous crime of being human.

^-.-^

[BlaqueKatt]

Honestly, I find no fault at all with this particular decision.<snip>
Unfortunately, there are those times when something does happen, and then the bloodthirsty whip out the pitchforks to go after an overworked father who has to live with the memory of finding his daughter under that bean bag chair for the rest of his life because obviously that's not enough suffering for his heinous crime of being human.

And parents who wish to kill their children can just say it was an "accident" or leave them in a car on a hot day because they won't be punished for it. Even when the police believe it was intentional. "Because they've suffered enough." And it's because of the mindset "I would never intentionally harm a child, so obviously no one else ever could". I'm sure parents who kill their kids in drunk driving accidents are also grieving, I guess we should "cut them some slack" as well.

I did a search for the original article, and found it-according to the timeline, he put her in the beanbag chair at around midnight, and after finding her dead, called his wife....then his mother....then 911.

Meyer does not admit guilt

funny that

"This was 100 percent my fault. ... I should know better than to have put the baby where I put her," Meyer told investigators.

interesting how that changed after facing jail time.

[Glados]

I don't understand the logic behind criminalizing someone in this situation. We have gotten to the point that we expect parents to foresee every possible danger and that is impossible. I would have never thought that a bean bag chair could be fatal.

Parents often have to juggle multiple responsibilities and are exhausted. I see nothing criminal in this father's actions. His actions were not the best possible option and sadly ended in tragedy but he did not do anything criminal.

[Andara Bledin]

And parents who wish to kill their children can just say it was an "accident" or leave them in a car on a hot day because they won't be punished for it.

I don't really feel the need to defend myself against things that I never said.

^-.-^

[jackfaire]

And parents who wish to kill their children can just say it was an "accident" or leave them in a car on a hot day because they won't be punished for it.

Woah those are worlds apart. Putting your daughter in a chair that most parents would agree they thought safe versus doing something that is widely acknowledged as a death sentence are two different things.

The car thing parents hear about all the time and know how dangerous that is unless they are criminally stupid.

A bean bag chair? This is the first time I have ever heard of a child being harmed by one. Ever.

[Gravekeeper]

A bean bag chair? This is the first time I have ever heard of a child being harmed by one. Ever.

Likewise. Its a tragedy, but I don't think it was intentional and I don't think jail time would fix anything.

[Ginger Tea]

Until I read the first linked article, I just assumed the child was under a beanbag chair and the father slumped into it, that would be horrific in itself, but I don't think anyone is in the habbit of lifting up a bean bag chair to make sure nothing is underneath it.

Turns out this was not the case, but if it was, jail would not be an option in my books.

[Andara Bledin]

I did a search for the original article, and found it-according to the timeline, he put her in the beanbag chair at around midnight, and after finding her dead, called his wife....then his mother....then 911.

One: I'm not sure what the time he put her on the chair has to do with anything. Honestly the "time line" you mention is sparse and not anything close to what I was expecting form the use of the phrase "time line."

Two: Yes, the guy panicked. People who find themselves in terrible circumstances do this all the time, as do those who have no reason to even be panicking in the first place.

Honestly, without far more information that anyone not part of the actual investigation is going to receive, I find it appalling that so many people are so quick to grab up the torches and cry for blood.

^-.-^

[BlaqueKatt]

A bean bag chair? This is the first time I have ever heard of a child being harmed by one. Ever.

Injury and Death Statistics Related to Bean Bag Chairs

At least five deaths related to bean bag chairs were reported to the CPSC by 1995, prior to the government regulations set forth in 1996. The deaths occurred when children unzipped the chairs and crawled inside. The small, fibrous pellets were inhaled, causing asphyxiation resulting in death.

At least 27 other incidences where children have choked on the pellets were also reported prior to CPSC standards.

One: I'm not sure what the time he put her on the chair has to do with anything. Honestly the "time line" you mention is sparse and not anything close to what I was expecting form the use of the phrase "time line."

why would you put a four month old in front of the TV at around midnight(he called 911 at 2:47 am-three hours after he put her in the beanbag chair balanced on the couch), why not say put them in a crib? what the fark is a four month old doing up at that hour and what four month old even has the attention span to watch tv?

[Andara Bledin]

It's a 4-month-old. They only tend to sleep between 4 & 6 hours at that point. It's easily possible the child had been sleeping and woken up and been fussy.

As for why put the kid in front of the TV, it's for the same reason you hang a mobile over the crib - to give them something that moves to look at and be distracted by.

I keep saying, over and over, that we don't have nearly enough information to make judgments regarding this man's culpability. The judge, who I expect had all of the information the prosecution had at hand, told him, "There is nothing I can do to punish you more than you've already been punished." Without access to that same information, cries for more punishment are out of line and presumptuous.

^-.-^

[jackfaire]

Injury and Death Statistics Related to Bean Bag Chairs

Okay one both of those involve the pellets inside. A 4 month old would not be able to get the bean bag chair open and crawl inside.

Also a bean bag chair is malleable. It doesn't tend to be stiff so would take on more of a nest like form and be a good place to put a young child where they would be comfortable and not likely to move much.

I don't entirely understand the part where he put it on a couch but I wouldn't call that intentional.

As far as a kid being up that time of night. That is the norm. My daughter slept through the night every night. She was not normal. At first I actually worried about it because of the fact most kids that age commonly wake up in the night.

I also don't entirely understand why he wasn't in the same room as his kid.

Understand I do think there are things he did wrong as a parent but things that he isn't alone in doing. If he had left the room and nothing happened to his kid most parents wouldn't even question the fact he left her alone.

I think as far as jail time that sending him to jail is a waste of my money. I think intent is a very important factor when a judge determines punishment.

The bean bag thing as a dad I was unware of any issues with bean bag chairs ever being an issue and I doubt I am alone. No it's not because I don't care. Believe me I freaked out for an hour when my daughter fell off the bed the first time only to have many medical professionals tell me to lighten up it happens.

I have to stop myself from being overprotective. That being said in an accident that causes death two things should be taken into account when deciding punishment intent like I said but also foreknowledge.

For example we know putting a kid in the car and shutting it can and has killed kids unless your living under a rock, as well as drinking and driving.

Foreknowledge is the first component in that if the thing that happened is relatively common knowledge then the person should go through jail time because they should a lack of caring about the consequences of actions they knew yielded bad results.

However if it is not something commonly thought to be a problem as far as likely the person wasn't aware of the dangers then we have to look at intent. Yes some situations are harder to judge intent as others but here is the key.

Think about how you would kill someone unless the method you would use involves putting snakes on the plane and hoping they bite the guy you want dead then chances are the more elaborate a death the less likely intent was there.

If you look at how someone died and the odds are really fucking small it could happen and you know for a fact it was an accident then chances are the person didn't purposely put the person in the situation hoping an accident would happen.

This then leaves that no matter what you do to the person they have been punished worse than anything you could ever do and jail time just means your going to punish the tax payers and maybe get a "less violent" criminal released from jail early.

"Well this guy killed and butchered 2 30 year old women in cold blood."

"This guy killed a 4 month old"

"Fuck well we need the space cut loose the first guy"

If space in a jail needs to be made and the only way is to early parole someone they aren't necessarily going to delve into the full details of what happened they are going to look at what the crime was.

If I was on that parole board with just those facts not knowing that the second one didn't kill his kid in cold blood I would vote to let the first guy go because he seems sane by comparison.

So now I paid taxes for him to be taking up a bed in a jail cell and to bump a more dangerous guy out into the free world.

[Andara Bledin]

I also don't entirely understand why he wasn't in the same room as his kid.

The article states that he want to the other room to watch TV and fell asleep.

It's possible he had intended to nap, but it's also possible that he had intended to let her watch the cartoons for a bit, then put her back to bed.

^-.-^

[jackfaire]

The article states that he want to the other room to watch TV and fell asleep.

I don't understand because it's not my parenting style. I am not going to tell people how to raise their kids but my daughter at that age I couldn't fathom leaving her unattended.

I get that he went to the other room and all that it's more along the lines of I don't understand how someone could enjoy watching Football because I don't enjoy it. I understand they do but I don't understand how they can.