Military Reenlistment and the general public

[IDrinkaRum]

I'm saying don't enlist in the first place.

The military is where everyone is the same. Dresses the same. Eats the same. Thinks the same. It's a given (and it's not only shown in real life, but in movies and tv shows - so there's no way people don't know what is going to happen if they do enlist). And besides, the military isn't the only line of work that puts themselves in danger (think: police).

If a person wants to stay in, knowing the possibility that they'll be called up, more power to them.

As I've said before, my father was in the Air Force for 23 years. He was in the communications squadron. He could have been called at any time for any conflict that came up. He knew that. My mother knew that. My sister & I both knew that. We accepted that as we knew that is what happens in the Military.

As I've also said, I come from a career military family. My father was 23 years. His younger brother was in the Navy for almost 20. My mother's father was military for 30 years (4 in the Navy during World War II and then 26 in the Air Force when he was drafted during the Korean War). Military is a career and a life. I didn't join because I knew the military wasn't for me. I was realistic. But if I had military inclinations, I would have either joined at 18 (right out of High School) or after getting my 4 year degree (at 21/22) and I'd either have 2 years left of my enlistment or 5-6 years left. I would have, if given the choice, automatically enlisted for 20 years. I would have tried out for the Communications Squadron (like my Dad). If that happened, I would have probably been sent over to the Wars we've had (communications is one of the most important things besides the troops who are taught to fight and kill). And I would have said "Yes, Sir!" No questions asked because that is what would have been expected for me.

For those with no family history in the Military, this way of thinking might be foreign to them.

Also, for the record? I've talked to veterans who came back horribly mutilated. And 90% of them said that if they were able to, they'd re-enlist and go back. Not all military people who fight want nothing more to do with the military.

And being disfigured isn't anything new for military personnel. Read the horror stories of the American Civil War (cannonballs, horse pummelings, unsanitary conditions and doctors who really didn't know any better). World War I & II with their casualties and their war wounded. The post traumatic stress syndrome that disfigured the minds of a lot of the Viet Nam vets.

I'm not sorry if my stance irks people. This is my way of thinking because of my background. And I'm proud to have family in the military and would support any of my family who chose to join now.

[Greenday]

A lot of guys that I know that are in the Army plan to re-enlist. I mean, how do you go from that kind of lifestyle, especially if you are in combat, to a desk job? That's a huge freaking difference.

One of my friend's boyfriends is in the Army. He tore some ligaments and for the time being, they won't let him go back to the Middle East and are making him do a desk job. He's going crazy doing that boring crap.

It really does become a lifestyle of its own. Some of us have no problem being deskjockeys. So why is it so unfathomable that people enjoy being in the service?

[the_std]

It's not that it's unfathomable that people like it. It's just not unfathomable that people try it and don't like it. It's not unfathomable that they want to get out. If you want to do it for four years and then get out, why is that a problem? Or a bad thing? Lots of people change careers, some quite often. I don't think it's unreasonable that people who join might wanna get out. Yes, for a lot of people it's their lives, and they wanna do it forever, and that's fine for them. Not everyone is like that.

[AdminAssistant]

And a lot of people use the military as a stepping stone. Example: a person puts in 4-6 years in the service. At the end, they get a college education, paid for. That enables them to better their situation - financial or whatever. For people who can't afford college, it's a way to do that. There is a considerable risk, of course, but it's more of a means to an end than a long-term way of life. And that's perfectly fine. My previous supervisor was in the Navy for 6 years and a reservist for a while after that. I asked her why she joined, she just shrugged and said, "It was a way to get out of town for a while. See new places." Not everyone joins because of some greater sense of the common good.

Also, I think people still have the idea that the military = Full Metal Jacket and Apocalypse Now. Everyone has to go through boot camp, sure, but beyond that - if you're a chef, you do chef things. If you're in com, you deal with com technology. If you're a Marine, an Army Ranger, a Navy SEAL - THEN you learn how to break someone's neck with your bare hands. That's when you're parachuting into enemy territory with a rifle and a knife. A very small percentage of the total military community.

[AFPheonix]

It's not that it's unfathomable that people like it. It's just not unfathomable that people try it and don't like it. It's not unfathomable that they want to get out. If you want to do it for four years and then get out, why is that a problem? Or a bad thing? Lots of people change careers, some quite often. I don't think it's unreasonable that people who join might wanna get out. Yes, for a lot of people it's their lives, and they wanna do it forever, and that's fine for them. Not everyone is like that.

There's also the possibility that some people who choose to not reenlist do so because morally they're opposed to what they're doing in other places. It's like a lot of other jobs. For some, it was a good decision at the time, but once they got there they decided it wasn't for them. It's all good.

[IDrinkaRum]

All the points are good. However, when confronted by a person who obviously wants to stay in the military, don't treat them like they're insane. It might not be for you or me, but it might be for someone else, no matter if their life will in danger or not.

And don't forget, you get to see the world! Dangerous parts and not so dangerous parts too!

[Boozy]

All the points are good. However, when confronted by a person who obviously wants to stay in the military, don't treat them like they're insane.

I think we all agreed on that.

But certainly we can also all agree that someone might want to do their four years and be done with it? That's a valid choice as well. To each their own.

[Pedersen]

I'm just pointing out that no matter what you do, no matter how "safe" you are in your comfy, cozy center of your universe, there is a possibility of dying. Either violently or not.

There's also the perceived levels of danger.

How dangerous do people believe it to be to drive to and from work? To spend the day working in the office? To go out to lunch within a short distance of that office? Now, compare that to the perceived level of danger for the same person in a military position, especially considering that you have no guarantees that you will not be sent to the front lines of a combat zone.

That, right there is why non-military people don't understand how you could love a military lifestyle. That was the point of my original answer. I do not agree with their actions of browbeating someone about it, but I do understand it.

And don't forget, you get to see the world! Dangerous parts and not so dangerous parts too!

And, as a side bonus, if your child is born in a foreign country under the right circumstances, they can be unable to consider running for President. They can worry about being put on a no-fly list due to their country of birth. They can find themselves unable to ever visit the country of their birth, since they do not want to deal with the consequences.

Yeah, that's me!

My dad was in the Air Force when I was born. Ankara, Turkey, 1971. I'm a US citizen, but was not born on US soil. I already hear everybody gearing up to tell me "Wrong! If you're born on a US military installation in a foreign country, then you were born on US soil!" Little snag with the US military at that time: There was no military base in Ankara at the time (this is told to me by my Dad, who was stationed there). No such thing as on-base housing, etc. A presence, yes, but no actual base.

So, as far as the Turkish government is concerned, I'm a Turkish male who has not done his time in the Turkish military as yet (all Turkish males are required to spend two years in the Turkish army on turning 18). So, if ever I vist, I'll get an extended stay. I've even heard tell of people who were considerably past their prime being inducted (one of them was 62) on getting off the plane. So, can't visit the country. Can't run for president. Turkey is close enough to the Middle East that every time I go to board a flight, I worry that I will be denied boarding because of the country I was born in.

Anyway, enough of the off-topic rant. Sorry about that.

One other point: I said "perceived levels of danger" above for a reason. I know that perception and reality are often very different, and that time served in the military can be safer (in some cases) than the daily commute to work. But people do not see/understand that bit of reality. They still shouldn't berate the person who chooses the military lifestyle, though. If anything, their respect should go up a notch or two. It's tough work. Anybody that can do it, and do it for a lifetime, deserves rather a lot of respect.

[wanderingjoe72]

Coming out of the service myself, I knew people that went both ways on reenlistment. Some of us planned for it, while others laughed at the retention office when pestered to stay in. I got the boot because I got fat and slow by Army standards.

It is an odd lifestyle that most people cannot deal with. It is definitely not a job in the traditional sense. I am kind of glad to be out though. I didn't so much mind the deployments or the day to day, but all the extra crap to deal with. High school recruits that had no idea what discipline was. Jerks that thought rank was more than it was. Busy work was a huge pet peeve of mine. As an NCo I was liked in the fact that I didn't believe in busy work. You do your job well and you will be rewarded by getting to take it easy for an hour or so at the end of the day. Our areas were clean and neat, so that was all we needed. Others didn't share that view so head will clash and it just got to a point where someone with little man syndrome would cause trouble for everyone.

So if you are in, happy and want to stay in, more power to you. If you decided you are done, let me shake your hand on your way out.

So if your knowledge of military life is from movies, then it will be very difficult to truly understand all that goes into it.

[Shards]

I must say, I completely understand where the OP is coming from.

For those who don't know, I signed on as a member of the US Marine Corps about 2 weeks ago, and had been considering it seriously for some time before that.

I can understand everything you're all saying about why people feel the way I do, and I do understand exactly why people are so afraid of the life, but, speaking as a guy who is on his way in, I don't care. I understand why my mother, grandmother, father, and all my friends are scared for me, but that doesn't make it any less patronizing and annoying when they give me the lecture on why I shouldn't do it, despite the fact that the deed is done, and I've been sworn in. It doesn't change the fact that MEPS, the closest thing I've yet had to military life, was one of the best days of my life. It doesn't change the fact that school, desk jobs, and anything with a white collar has never been right for me, and it doesn't change the fact that this was my decision, and browbeating me for it because they don't understand it isn't going to change it.

[Flyndaran]

Strange. I don't understand the urge to put oneself in harms way. But I wouldn't judge someone unsound of mind if they truly felt that doing so was of greater benefit to others.
I dislike those that reenlist now, because the american nation is continuing to commit war crimes, and anyone that actively joins such a group is passively supporting it.
If I were in the military when word of Bush's et al. grotesque war crimes broke out, then I would have put my gear down and chose jail over continued service.

Edit: I want to make perfectly clear that I am not singling out you or any other poster as individuals. I am only stating my views about about your and others' actions and what I would do in vaguely similar situations.

[IDrinkaRum]

And would anyone feel the same way if all these people were signing up to be cops in their city? They're putting themselves in harm's way. They're protecting the citizenry. And yes, sometimes there is corruption in the ranks. And sometimes the cops do do things that aren't exactly the greatest.

[the_std]

If you haven't noticed, IDaR, there is as much contempt for the cops as there is for the military. Just look at how many threads on CS have devolved into "I hate cops" threads. I'd say that a lot of people would say the same things about cops as they do about the military. It might not be as political a hot-button issue but it seems that that mentality is rife within the general population.

[Slytovhand]

One slight difference between police and military - you can just up and quite being a copper. I don't think the same is true of armed services. For that matter, if you just decide to NCNS - effectively abandoning your job, all you get is a nasty black mark on your resume. You try that in military, you spend a while in a jail for desertion (presuming you don't get shot...)

Besides, signing on to be a cop doesn't automatically mean you will be shooting at people - or help people to kill others - so there is a difference.

And, lastly, as a police officer, you are upholding the laws of your land, not trying to force laws onto others in a different land.

(yeah, a few generalisations.. but the term 'military' is general as well)

Shards, as much as those around you might be thinking your an idiot for joining up in this state of world affairs.. keep your butt safe! (humans react various ways when they feel their world is being threatened. If you're a part of their world, then they are reacting... and how do we deal with stuff which we can't control??? You're finding out. Just try and take it that they care - and are scared for you).

[Evandril]

Besides, signing on to be a cop doesn't automatically mean you will be shooting at people - or help people to kill others - so there is a difference.

And, lastly, as a police officer, you are upholding the laws of your land, not trying to force laws onto others in a different land.

(yeah, a few generalisations.. but the term 'military' is general as well)

I've got some problems with these two statements, even with the qualifier at the end. I've been *in* the military for 16+ years, and have yet to shoot at anyone, nor have I even been issued a weapon with the expectation I might. There are parts of the military that go off and shoot at people...but there is a LARGE percentage that does not. (Yes, I've been deployed to the desert more than once...but I fix planes, not shoot)

The military as a whole does NOT do anything but listen to the orders we're given...Forcing laws on others tends to come above our 'paygrade' as it were There are exceptions to this...but they are just that, exceptions.