I'm a sinner, but at least I'm married

[Parrothead]

Cis is when sex (what's between your legs) and gender (what you perceive yourself as) are the same thing.

So yes, you're a ciswoman.

[Kara_CS]

Right. I'm transgender. When I was born, my gender didn't match my physical sex. The official, technical term for a person who was born with matching gender and bodies is "cisgender." Basically if you aren't transgender, intersex, bigender, agender, or any other classification that doesn't fit into the traditional binary genders, you are cisgender. Because "cisgender" is a more polite distinction that people who claim they are "normal" in terms of gender and doesn't suggest there's something wrong with the rest of us.

[Gravekeeper]

Yeah, and it wasn't even the parties getting married who had to agree on it. It was a matter of "Hello sir, here's a bag of coins, I'd like your daughter to make my babies." And dad would say, "Throw in a goat and she's yours." That was pretty much it for any kind of traditions or ceremonies for a long time.

Actually, what you're referring too was a price paid to the family losing a daughter to compensate for losing a family member and thus the benefits she provided the family group. It appears mainly in polygamous societies due to the imbalance in how many women per 1 man. Thus women were valuable and losing a family member and thus the labour they provided to the family unit needed to compensated.

This is why you see it creep up in the Old Testament ( Which was Team Polygamy ). If you seduced a virgin, you had to take her as your wife and pay her father for her. But the father could still refuse to give her too you, and you would still legally owe him compensation. ( The Old Testament was very you break it you buy it. >.> )

Again though, that's a thing mainly with Judaism and Christianity. In Islam, you paid the wife herself and that wealth was hers to keep and could not be deprived from her by anyone. A similar practice occurred in Germanic cultures and eventually spread through Europe and into the Church in the middle ages. Forming the basis of the idea nowadays that after a divorce the wife is entitled to some measure of the husband's property to support herself.

If you go way back in the area of question where the Abrahamic religions started up, it was actually polygamous but matriarchal. You could have multiple wives, but you were required to provide each wife with a private room of her own in the house which you and other males were not permitted to enter whatsoever. It was her personal independent domain. You were also required to divide your time and, er, affections amongst all your wives equally or any you neglected were allowed to divorce you without consequence.

The concept of marrying for love is relatively recent in the grand scheme of things, something that extremist conservative groups fail to recognize. Because then they'd be forced to admit that the definition of marriage has been changed and accepted as the norm since Genesis.

Well, the fundamental problem is that "Traditional Marriage" never existed as a facet of Christianity. If they point to Genesis and Adam & Eve and claim they were married, then they have to admit traditional marriage is polygamous because that's how the Old Testament defines it. Never mind that the Old Testament also states you have to marry anyone you rape ( Her input in the matter is ignored. -.- )

Furthermore, the Old Testament is of course lifted from Judaism. In Judaism, the covenant of marriage was a legal one. It involved a contract that outlined the duties of both parties to each other and it was quite specific ( The husband for instant had to legally provide food, shelter and emotional support to his wife ). To them, the lawyer aspect of marriage WAS the holy covenant part.

If they try to use the New Testament, that doesn't work either because when Jesus talks about marriage in the New Testament, he, being Jewish, references the Old Testament. Then just to add icing to the cake, the Bible also specifically says to follow the law of the authorities ( government ) on Earth for they are authorities because God let them be such.

So if a fundamentalist says "Traditional Marriage" they have to admit that traditional marriage as far as God was concerned was either polygamy, proposal by rape or purely a legal construct where God demanded a pre-nup.

>.>

[telecom_goddess]

Well let's see....your mother would hate me as well. I"m pansexual, with a girlfriend who's a female spirit in a male body. So she has man parts but is all woman. But has masculine qualities too which I just love. And is a sadist, is my mistress, and I'm her pet.

And I"m an atheist, and tend to lean towards polyamory as well.

[Kara_CS]

Well let's see....your mother would hate me as well. I"m pansexual, with a girlfriend who's a female spirit in a male body. So she has man parts but is all woman. But has masculine qualities too which I just love. And is a sadist, is my mistress, and I'm her pet.

And I"m an atheist, and tend to lean towards polyamory as well.

I'd almost feel sorry for my mother if she wasn't so deliberately in denial. She must have a hell of a time time trying to pretend I'm someone she thought she knew 15 years ago by somehow completely ignoring every bit of visual input going to her brain every time she sees me while also pretending my fiancee is a ciswoman so she can also pretend that I'm still that person and "straight" so she doesn't also doesn't have to accept I'm pansexual. My mother's lucky she doesn't even know what Fetlife is, or I might let it slip that's where we met :P

[dentarthurdent]

I'd almost feel sorry for my mother if she wasn't so deliberately in denial. She must have a hell of a time time trying to pretend I'm someone she thought she knew 15 years ago

Oh. This. So much this. My mother talks about how my father is trying to pretend I'm still the same person I was when he left when I was 16. Obviously she's doing something similar.

My mother's lucky she doesn't even know what Fetlife is, or I might let it slip that's where we met :P

*Blanches* I certainly hope my mother doesn't know what Fetlife is. I'm not sure whether she'd be more disturbed by the ageplay and primal play that goes on between me and my husband, or that I have boyfriends, or (in the future) that I will have girlfriends, but...at this point I'm just trying to decide if it's worth the constant denial and occasional shouting matches to keep dealing with her.

I know that sounds cold. I'm on the verge of shutting my dad out of my life already.

[Andara Bledin]

at this point I'm just trying to decide if it's worth the constant denial and occasional shouting matches to keep dealing with her.

I know that sounds cold. I'm on the verge of shutting my dad out of my life already.

It's not cold to shut people who are toxic out of your life: It's the most rational decision. You can't make them stop being toxic, that's on them. But you can make it so that their toxicity doesn't spill into your life.

It's tough to have to shut someone out of your life, but if they can't be decent human beings, they don't deserve to be there.

[siead_lietrathua]

It's not cold to shut people who are toxic out of your life: It's the most rational decision.

QFT. sometimes you just gotta let a relationship go for your own health and sanity. be it a romantic, friend or familial one.

[Gravekeeper]

Amen to that. Learned that lesson the hard way when I was young and stupid. >.>