this is what happens when religion is in charge

[smileyeagle1021]

I don't have my moral worldview because I'm religious; I'm my religion because it fits in with my moral worldview.

^-.-^

To some extent that is a chicken and the egg.
While this does not apply to everybody, most people form their worldview based on what their parents believe, which is often based on the religion they have chosen, which then the child chooses because it matches the worldview they learned from their parents, and then they have kids and the cycle continues.
Like I said, this does not apply to everyone, but it happens often enough that it can easily be called a trend. How else would you explain how the vast majority of people chose the same church as their parents?

[Andara Bledin]

If religion didn't exist, I'd still be me.

And if religion didn't exist, Franco would still have stolen the children of those who didn't support him.

Corruption exists just fine without religion. It just finds religion a handy tool and scapegoat.

^-.-^

[KabeRinnaul]

So... I can see two motivational forces behind this already. Money and Religious beliefs. Combining the two make more evil.

Money and politics are the motivation. Religion is the excuse.

In addition, it appears that all of these incidents happened in Catholic-run hospitals. Now, it may be that all of the hospitals in Spain were, at the time, Catholic-run, but there still seems to be a strong correlation between religion being in charge and the devout doing horrible things.

We've been given two or three examples, in something that took place over the course of what, 40 years? And everything I look up, I keep seeing those same 2-3 examples, from the same 2-3 witnesses, over and over. And any group, regardless of religion, has members who will abuse power.

There's a correlation between religion being in charge and the religious doing horrible things.
There's a correlation between atheists being in charge and the atheist doing horrible things.
There's a correlation between conservatives being in charge and the conservative doing horrible things.
There's a correlation between liberals being in charge and the liberal doing horrible things.

Power corrupts. Doesn't matter who has it. The inherent hypocrisy just hits harder when the ones doing horrible things are supposed to be moral beacons.

It kind of does.
For a religious person, religion is such a large part of their lives that everything they do is at least indirectly motivated by religion (if at no other level than it affects their moral worldview).

Some people are just assholes. Again, religion just becomes an excuse. The kind of person who would follow Jesus's teaching to do unto others as you would have them do unto you, is probably the kind of person who would treat others with respect regardless of their faith. The kind of person who would be a dick because they figure they're morally pure anyway (such as your Already Saved example) would be on that same high horse and treat others poorly anyway. Religion just gives them a warm fuzzy feeling when they do it.

Which they'd probably get by just dwelling on their perceived personal superiority anyway.

[Ghel]

And any group, regardless of religion, has members who will abuse power.

...

Power corrupts. Doesn't matter who has it.

This strikes me as very likely to be true. Religions, though, tend to cover up such abuses of power in order to protect the religion. Other groups, such as atheist organizations, will call out the corrupted in their midst and say, "that person doesn't speak (or act) for us." Religious groups rarely do that.

The inherent hypocrisy just hits harder when the ones doing horrible things are supposed to be moral beacons.

On this, we agree.

[Andara Bledin]

Oh, there are plenty of us who are religious who will call out such people as not representing us.

We're usually told by people who aren't part of whatever religion we follow that we're not "real" followers.

^-.-^

[HYHYBT]

Oh, there are plenty of us who are religious who will call out such people as not representing us.

We're usually told by people who aren't part of whatever religion we follow that we're not "real" followers.

^-.-^

And sometimes by those within, too.

Any group, just like any individual if not moreso, has an interest in protecting its reputation. Some, whether religion-based or not, choose to put that ahead of ethics and justice. Others do not.

[Hyena Dandy]

I think that the Protestant Reformation is a good example of people within a religion calling bullshit on corruption.

[Kheldarson]

I think that the Protestant Reformation is a good example of people within a religion calling bullshit on corruption.

It is...but it isn't at the same time. Up until Luther decided to pull away from the Church entirely and ignored the pope, it was a good example. But when he decided to start working outside the system, then it was a bad example. Plus, at that point, it was more politics than religion anyway.

[Hyena Dandy]

It is...but it isn't at the same time. Up until Luther decided to pull away from the Church entirely and ignored the pope, it was a good example. But when he decided to start working outside the system, then it was a bad example. Plus, at that point, it was more politics than religion anyway.

No, its still a good example. He was a member of the religion. He called bullshit on fellow members of the religion. That is what Ghel said doesn't happen. That happened.He left because they didn't LISTEN, but that's not what Ghel said. And, after time, they DID change. So it is a good example.

[Kheldarson]

Actually, he got kicked out because he, as a member of a religious order, refused to obey orders by the head of the religious order. He was told to not write anything else and come down to talk directly to the pope. He refused and published the Babylonian Captivity. It was then that he was excommunicated. He was told that if he would come down and talk to the pope, the ban would be lifted. He still refused. And then went into hiding with the local princes. That is not a good example of working within the system.

Also, for a guy who was supposedly not listened to, he did a lot of accusing on topics that weren't even relevant to his main complaint the single time he went before any authority figure.