People Required to Clear the Sidewalks in Front of Their Homes

[telecom_goddess]

If I have to walk on snow/ice...which I do here once in a while...I have shoe chains I put on. Those things keep me on my feet. That is some traction

As for shoveling walks...I don't have that issue in an apartment but if I did I would probably shovel it...but the thing is if some people shovel and some don't that kinda makes the sidewalks worse in terms of walking.

[jackfaire]

you'd think the city were asking homeowners to shoot their puppies instead of just being slightly inconvenienced to keep up their property.

If it were their property they could tell people to keep the hell off of it.

[lordlundar]

Yeah, my city has that as well. Which is odd, seeing as we're the furthest north major city in Canada.

The worst part is every time a city councilor brings it up in a debate the reporters go out to their home addresses and the ones who scream the loudest have the worst sidewalks.

Here, it's nothing more than a cash grab.

[Bloodsoul]

Yesterday I shoveled the sidewalk and portion of the road from one neighbor's driveway to the other neighbor's driveway. I've now the cleanest sidewalk alongside one of said neighbors and the church/temple parkinglot further down the road.

Now, as for the folk across the street...

[Tanasi]

Either you own the land or you don't. If I own I'll invite people to stay off of it for their own safety, if I don't then I have no responsiblity. However is some silly ordiance say I must clear a public space and if I don't I'll be fined or potenially jailed then that puts me in servitude to the "government" and that violates 13th admendment.

[the_std]

However is some silly ordiance say I must clear a public space and if I don't I'll be fined or potenially jailed then that puts me in servitude to the "government" and that violates 13th admendment.

So... Shoveling your sidewalk is unconstitutional?

Wow. Just... Wow.

[Wingates_Hellsing]

So... Shoveling your sidewalk is unconstitutional?

Wow. Just... Wow.

No, being forced to shovel your sidewalk is unconstitutional. This isn't prison where many of your rights as a citizen are forfeit.

I get how it seems we're making a big stink over a little thing, but they're no less important for being small. A breach is still a breach and letting it just sit there without a fight only invites more, quite the opposite of what's needed.

[guywithashovel]

Either you own the land or you don't. If I own I'll invite people to stay off of it for their own safety, if I don't then I have no responsiblity. However is some silly ordiance say I must clear a public space and if I don't I'll be fined or potenially jailed then that puts me in servitude to the "government" and that violates 13th admendment.

There are two main things about this issue that stand out to me. First of all, as the article states, the law is rarely, if ever, enforced. I think that if a law isn't going to be enforced regularly, then it should be taken off the books. Second, many of the side streets here in the city don't get plowed until a few days after the snow falls, if at all. If the city isn't going to do their part and clear the road, I don't think they should be issuing fines to people for not clearing sidewalks (which they haven't done yet, as mentioned earlier).

[MaggieTheCat]

I really want to know what the big deal is. Is it that hard to shovel a sidewalk once in a while? I'm not talking about elderly people or disable people who have a difficult time getting around; I'm talking about those of you who have posted in this thread who are so vehemently against shoveling your sidewalks. I don't think any of you are that old or in that bad of health that it's nigh impossible to shovel a sidewalk (and if any of you are, then ignore this post.)

And I say "once in a while" because I don't know any area where it snows every single day during the winter, mandating that you get out there every single day to shovel. Let's say it snows 3 days a week, and it takes you 10 minutes to shovel every time it snows. I'm pulling numbers out of the air here, based on what I remember northern Wisconsin being like. Obviously some weeks it may snow more often, or there may be more snow meaning it will take longer than 10 minutes to clear. But on average, let's say it takes 30 minutes a week to clear your sidewalks.

What's the big deal?

And really, guys, don't say "it's the principle of the thing!" because I've read plenty of posts, here and on CS, about what a B.S. excuse that is when a sucky customer is arguing about something trivial, like how many peppermint patties they get in a bag.

I want to hear a reason, other than "It isn't TECHNICALLY my property, therefore I shouldn't be responsible for it" as to why people shouldn't shovel their sidewalks. What about being decent human beings to your neighbors? What if you went walking down the street and slipped and fell on the sidewalk outside of a business? Can you honestly say that you wouldn't at least tell the business to clear their sidewalk or put some salt down so nobody else gets hurt?

[daleduke17]

I really want to know what the big deal is. Is it that hard to shovel a sidewalk once in a while?

If it is my sidewalk, I have no problem. It is when the city tells me to shovel THEIR sidewalk (the walk that parallels the street is city property in most locales) I have a problem with that. I want to see a person fight the city with the 13th Amendment argument and see what comes of it.

[IDrinkaRum]

Who the eeef cares?

Really.

If someone tried to fight the city on the 13th Amendment, I'd be protesting against the citizen. Even my ex-boss @ the gaming store, who is a lawyer understands the reasoning behind the laws and abides them. (And this man, who is a lawyer, is still an original flower child/hippie in his political thinking so don't think it's conservatives who say we need to obey the law and make sure our sidewalks are cleared).

And COMMON DECENCY. Remember this: IF everyone in your city/town had the common decency to actually remove the snow from the sidewalks, there wouldn't be a law mandating it. Come on ... THINK about it. Really, just think. People are lazy, people are stupid, and people are so egomaniacal, they think everything is about them.

Get off your butts. If my husband, who even though he's lost weight, but is still in the 440 pound range, with bad knees, bad feet, and an umbilical hernia who really shouldn't be picking up heavy objects (and yes, I classify hefting a shovel full of snow as a heavy object - as does his doctor), is out there shoveling, then I darn well expect everyone else out on the block to be doing the same. Law or no law.

If you want the law abolished, do something radical: SHOVEL. And then march your butts to the city council/whatever makes the laws in your town, and look into how to ge that law repealed.

But until then, I repeat: SHOVEL

[HYHYBT]

I want to hear a reason, other than "It isn't TECHNICALLY my property, therefore I shouldn't be responsible for it" as to why people shouldn't shovel their sidewalks.

See, in that one sentence you've conflated two separate things. Saying people should not BE REQUIRED TO shovel a public right of way is not at all the same as saying they shouldn't do it. To me it's theoretical anyway; we don't have sidewalks here and almost never have any snow either, though today is an exception (and thanks for lending us some, it's much appreciated!). But again, what about people who aren't HOME for a few days for whatever reason? And how, IN PRINCIPLE (and I don't care if that phrase is misused elsewhere) is a law requiring you to shovel a sidewalk that is not yours any different than one requiring you to shovel the street it's next to, which also is not yours? Think of all the money the city wastes on snowplows when they could just make people quit being lazy and shovel off the street!

[guywithashovel]

If someone tried to fight the city on the 13th Amendment, I'd be protesting against the citizen. Even my ex-boss @ the gaming store, who is a lawyer understands the reasoning behind the laws and abides them. (And this man, who is a lawyer, is still an original flower child/hippie in his political thinking so don't think it's conservatives who say we need to obey the law and make sure our sidewalks are cleared).

Judging from the comment section in the news article I posted as well as this thread, it seems that the people against such a law run the gamut in terms of political leanings. One of the comments on the article said that these types of laws were made my progressive liberals who want the government to do everything for them.

[MaseMan]

I'm sorry, but some of you obviously aren't home owners, or don't live in cold weather climates. I live in Wisconsin, and everyone shovels their sidewalks. It would be frankly stupid and plain lazy not to. It's partly a courtesy to pedestrians, and partly a safety issue. If I didn't shovel my walk, the mail couldn't get delivered. Also, along the safety issue line, what if there was a fire at your house, and your walk is covered with ice and snow, making it more difficult for firefighters to get to you? Yeah, not a good thing.

[DrFaroohk]

I think the issue is more about being forced to do so, rather than the reasons behind it.

Shoveling your sidewalk is a good idea. If I had a sidewalk that was regularly used I'd probably shovel it anyway. I would just hate being told that I HAD to. Like the seatbelt law. I usually wear my seatbelt anyway, and one would be stupid not to, but I hate being told that I HAVE to wear it. Screw off, big brother!